The BRS Deserves Our Support

Need advice from The British Residents Society in North Cyprus? Find out about and help charities in the TRNC.

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The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by WotNoDeeds »

Since President Akinci’s election the BRS has been very pro-active on behalf of British residents to ensure that in any settlement all owners of property with TRNC deeds are treated equally. They have written to and met with President Akinci and further meetings are scheduled between the BRS and President Akinci’s negotiating team. David Brown, Mike Maternaghan and Stephen Day deserve our thanks and support for doing a great job. The higher the membership, the greater the voice the BRS has, so If you’re not a member, now would be a good time to join and give them your support. We have just joined and the membership fee was very moderate .

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Re: THE BRS DESERVES OUR SUPPORT

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Post by tomsteel »

Highly commendable, but what is the BRS doing for the many expat who cannot get their title deeds from crooked banks, developers, land owners, builders etc even though bona fide contracts are held and payment has been made in full? I wonder what President Akinci's views are on this property problem. Will he take the recently adopted RoC approach?

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Soner »

Get all the advice you need for free from Kibkom members. Want a discount for anything, then just ask and it will usually be given. TC's in top positions pretend to show interest, out of politeness.

Tin hat on at the ready.
Support businesses that are supporting the Kibkom Forum - At least contact them for a quote.
This forum cannot exist without the support of both member and advertiser.
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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Soner »

BTW, BRS is a business as they charge for membership, so I will move this to the appropriate section.
Support businesses that are supporting the Kibkom Forum - At least contact them for a quote.
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Re: THE BRS DESERVES OUR SUPPORT

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Post by Groucho »

tomsteel wrote:Highly commendable, but what is the BRS doing for the many expat who cannot get their title deeds from crooked banks, developers, land owners, builders etc even though bona fide contracts are held and payment has been made in full? I wonder what President Akinci's views are on this property problem. Will he take the recently adopted RoC approach?
What is the recently adopted RoC approach?

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Groucho »

Soner wrote:BTW, BRS is a business as they charge for membership, so I will move this to the appropriate section.
Please move all Multimax related posts to the Verified Business Section.... by the same token they are also a paid for business!

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Keithcaley »

Soner wrote:BTW, BRS is a business as they charge for membership, so I will move this to the appropriate section.
The thread wasn't started by the BRS itself.

If you were to say that it belongs in 'Business' because someone other than the 'Business' has recommended them, I would say that the same applies to every recommendation for a Bar or Restaurant.

Gotcha!

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BRS POST HAS BEEN MOVED TO UNVERIFIED BUSINESSES SECTION

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Post by WotNoDeeds »

This post has been moved by Soner because the "BRS is a business as they charge for membership, so I will move this to the appropriate section"
so anyone interested in reading the post will find it there.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by WotNoDeeds »

The BRS, according to their factsheet , is "non-profit making", so strictly speaking not what I would call a business.
They were established in 1975 and their objective is to" foster friendly relations with the people of Cyprus, to advise
and assist members and ...make representation on their behalf to the authorities ".

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Bertie »

Very true WotnoDeeds. The BRS is a non trading Society, it is therefore, not a business.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by waddo »

WotNoDeeds, thank you for the information on what the BRS has been doing, a shame I had to read it on this forum as apart from the information regarding the letter sent there is actually no further information on the BRS website!!! Either on the "open" site or in the "Members" area. Why?
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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Bertie »

Are you a member?

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Ragged Robin »

The BRS is actually mentioned in the heading for "Charities and Societies" which would appear to be the appropriate place for it and there are several posts on the subject on that Board. There does seem to be a certain lack of clarity and logic in placing - and particularly moving threads - I queried one a week or two ago but never got a reply. I am not currently a member of BRS and and do not entirely approve of all they do, but it is a fact they are a well established institution in North Cyprus, and people may well want and need to hear what they are up to now. I doubt if many people have time to read the "Unverified Business" section so it does arouse thoughts of a deliberate attempt to suppress something.

However I do also agree with Waddo that the BRS should put more information on their own site: they do things that affect the lives a whole community members of which may have good reasons for not joining the BRS and the community are entitled to know what is being said/done ostensibly on their behalf without their prior knowledge or consent.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Bertie »

A representative of the BRS Committee can be seen at Lambousa Market and the Hut in Girne on a Saturday 10am-12pm. I am sure they would answer any questions anyone may have.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by waddo »

Bertie - Why ask if I am a member? Are you a member and if so you would know that a non-member can not access the "Members Area"? Perhaps if you were to re-read my post you would see that I did state "Either on the "open" site or in the "Members" area.", thus indicating that I had examined both areas!

I am fully aware that the BRS website is maintained on a voluntary basis and I have great respect for the person who completes this task as it is not easy at all, however, the question still stands.

Why do I have to read about what the BRS has done on an open web site when it is not available on the B RS website?

It raises the question yet again about why should membership be paid for? The only benefit that seems apparent is that membership will provide the member with a "Discount Card" for use in some areas. As most businesses are happy to give discount anyway, even that has little merit these days.
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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Bertie »

You may not be a member, but your partner may be a member and therefore you may access the BRS website by using their password!!!! As you say all the committee are volunteers, therefore, some things take longer to appear than others. From what I can make out you are damned if you do and damned if you don't.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Keithcaley »

Bertie wrote:...From what I can make out you are damned if you do and damned if you don't.
That's interesting Bertie, could you give me an example of where you, or your husband, the Hon Treasurer, or one of the other BRS Committee members, have been damned for 'doing', (that is, for actually Posting information on the BRS Website) rather than not posting information?

Kindest regards, Keith.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Ragged Robin »

Bertie's post re representatives is no doubt intended to be helpful, but as so often it overlooks the point that not everyone is able to get to the locations specified and there must also be many people for which Saturday morning is not a convenient time

Equally important is the fact that my experience with the BRS (and I would add other Brit. run local organisations) is that their response to questions as to what they are doing with regard to a specific issue is in effect "join us and we will tell you". This is catch 22, Surely I am not the only one who wants to know what an organisation's aims and actions are BEFORE I commit time and money to supporting them.

The problem is that there are so many expatriates , and as someone pointed out on a different thread re property ownership, we are often in different positions and have different needs and priorities. Some of the BRS' initiatives on behalf of some people may actually be harmful to others.

I had hoped a new Committee might at least have resulted in a greater accessibility and openness but this has not been my experience so far. Failure of disclosure cannot help but lead to suspicions of a "clique" protecting only the specific interests of a limited group of people.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by tomsteel »

RR spot on. I wonder just how many of the BRS Committee have yet to secure their title deeds from crooked banks, developers et al, let alone seeking assurances from the President on their far more 'secure' position? 'Clique' sums it up!

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Keithcaley »

Ragged Robin wrote:Bertie's post re representatives is no doubt intended to be helpful...
If you think that, then you are taking a far more charitable view than it deserves.

In my opinion, the post was dismissive, condescending, and completely ignores the question of why they can't post something useful on their website in a timely manner.

I'm amazed that a BRS Committee Member even deigned to talk to us plebians on here - and that she was authorised to do so!

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Ragged Robin »

I was just trying not to be too contentious, Keith . And I did not know that "Bertie" was a member of the Committee, let alone an exalted one! Obviously I dont get out enough or mix in the right company,

our pointsare the same, though. If the BRS want support they need to consider the problems of all sections of the community and to tell us what they are doing that could have a vital affect on our futures.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by waddo »

OK Bertie, I take your point that IF I had a partner and that IF that partner was a member then I could log on to the BRS website with that partners ID and login. However, I would not need to have a partner to do this IF was a hacker or IF a BRS member just game me their password or IF I was a member myself. Your understanding computer security needs upgrading I feel.

IF I were to contact a representative of the BRS at any of the locations you have indicated, would they answer questions regardless of me being a member or not? Would they simply tell me that I must become a member before they can discuss what is happening within the BRS? Whichever it is, I see no reason to contact them at any location when that information should already be available.

So, back to my original and still unanswered question: Why do I have to read about what the BRS has done on an open web site when it is not available on the BRS website?
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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Keithcaley »

Waddo, I'm also interested to know why she, 'Bertie', (AKA Elaine Dugan, BRS Committee Member, wife of Danny Dugan, Hon Treasurer of BRS) wanted to know if you were a Member of BRS - was it that you would get 'Preferential treatment' if you were a Member? - or was she going to just ignore you if you were one of the Hoi Poloi? - or was it the case that she has a special punishment reserved for those BRS Members who do not 'Toe the Line'? Image

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Does the BRS Deserve Our Support?

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Post by MoonageDaydream »

What is the situation with the BRS now?

I know there was an almighty row at their AGM a year or so ago when those who were trying to modernise the BRS got shouted down by the 'old guard' (who then gave up the fight becuase it was too much aggravation).

What has happened since? I refused to join after the AGM debacle, have things settled down? Is it now and organisation worth joining?

Are The Foreign Fesidents Group still meeting regularly?

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by waddo »

Beats me Keith, still waiting for an answer to a very simple question but in the true ways of politicians my question was answered with a question in the hopes that the original question would then get lost in any ensuing discussion.

As to why I should be asked on the open forum if I am member or not, obviously expecting a reply, actually fly's in the face of the statement on the BRS website about providing member information. IF I was a member then Bertie has forced me to go against the BRS statement simply by saying so, anyone who then knows me by my Forum name and who has ever emailed me via the forum would have access to a BRS members details - of course that would also be true if Bertie had emailed me with that question via the forum and I had replied (IF I was a member or not could have been checked with my email address against the database of BRS members which is open to all committee members) only Bertie would have know the answer to the question.

Computer security is not always about having a virus checker and a strong password - mainly it is about having common sense! And please do not start in on DPA - that is a minefield I am very glad that I am no longer involved it - lol.
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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Keithcaley »

waddo wrote:...As to why I should be asked on the open forum if I am member or not...
Actually the question of why she wanted to know did exercise me somewhat -

Was it because you, as a Member, would be treated more favourably than a non-Member?

OR...

Did she have some special punishment or sanction (banishment? ) lined up for you as a Member who did not 'Toe the Party Line'?

I suppose that time will tell
Last edited by Keithcaley on Tue 15 Sep 2015 12:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by waddo »

Worry not old friend - I will let you know, on the open forum of course.
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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by tomsteel »

I am currently a member. Perusal of the BRS Rules/Regulations does not appear to have any mention of sanctions/punishments/dismissal. That said, after the debacle of the AGM debacle 2 years ago, I fully expect to be defrocked for stating my view and my dismay that non-title deed holders were not included in the BRS Address to the TRNC President. Still no answer.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by waddo »

Look under the Contact Us flag and that will be the reason you did not get an answer - you are not supposed to contact "US" on an open forum or everyone will know....................
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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by PoshinDevon »

Very nearly became members of the BRS however the debacle of the AGM a while back and the lack of tranparency shown on there website has led us to believe this organisation is not one we want to be part of.

We are struggling as to exactly what you get for your money. A lot of information can be found or requested via this site.... not sure really what they offer. Maybe a BRS member could list the reasons for joining.....
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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by waddo »

Stop holding your breath Posh, it will only hurt you - lol.
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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by cambridge »

First things first. The BRS represents its' members and attempts to represent them on issues taking place in TRNC that may well affect them. It does not represent any person who is not a member. However if any agreement that they manage to make they are happy that non members may get the benefit. See the press release in relation the meetings held with the President and Government. Not a great deal to announce officially but to get 40mins of the Presidents time is an achievement.
If you are not a member why try to undermine them? They do not represent you or claim to.
If you are a member and you are not happy find yourself a rep. or go on the web site to voice your opinion. They always welcome help & experience.
BTW I am only a member nothing to do with them as a group. Just think I am better off as a member than not.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by WotNoDeeds »

The General Forum is surely an online discussion site where views can be exchanged? Unfortunately, this doesn't seem to be the case anymore. I posted my view of the present BRS and my reasons for my recently becoming a member. This post was then almost immediately moved to "Unverified Businesses", despite it not being a business (non-profit making, annual subscription 30TL) and as one commentator said this "does arouse thoughts of a deliberate attempt to suppress" and another suggested it was moved because "of personal prejudice". Why not allow subjects of general interest to be posted on the General Forum. If a subject is of general interest it will evoke a lot of response, if not it will rapidly sink without trace.

Regarding the BRS, their aim is to "foster friendly relations with the people of Cyprus, to ...assist members and ...make representation on their behalf to the authorities" which seems to me to be exactly what they are presently doing. This can't be a bad thing in the
present circumstances surely.
I agree with Cambridge. If you are not a member, why try to undermine them.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Ragged Robin »

[quote="cambridge"]"First things first. The BRS represents its' members and attempts to represent them on issues taking place in TRNC that may well affect them. It does not represent any person who is not a member. However if any agreement that they manage to make they are happy that non members may ge"!


Unfortunately the reverse also applies: if they make an agreement that is not one'sl interest, one is stuck with the consequences[/i


"They do not represent you or claim to".

Unfortunately the average Cypriot does not realise that the BRS only represents its members, not the disparate interests of the larger British Community as a whole. I wonder if the Government does?

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by cambridge »

I take the point with regard to agreements reached by BRS. However I find it difficult to imagine any agreement being reached that would not benefit the Expat community.
With regard to the perceptions of the Government about the BRS, I think it extremely unlikely that they don't know exactly who they are dealing with.
Finally is it not better to have tried than simply wait and see?

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Owl Lady »

Appears to be posted under Charities now! but probably get more hits now, thanks for the publicity.
Although I nearly started WW3 after the "AGM" I am still a member.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by waddo »

cambridge/wotnodeeds, I am not trying to "undermine" the BRS, I am trying to highlight the point that because they are a society with secrets there is general distrust over what they do and why they do it, if you are a member or not, distrust will fester and grow!

Their refusal to answer simple questions put to them on an open forum simply highlights this. My initial question was "WotNoDeeds, thank you for the information on what the BRS has been doing, a shame I had to read it on this forum as apart from the information regarding the letter sent there is actually no further information on the BRS website!!! Either on the "open" site or in the "Members" area. Why?".

A response to this was received within two hours "Are you a member?", what has that got to do with the question? From there on the discussion went down hill into ultimate silence. Now, I know how difficult it is to maintain any web site, I am also aware that once you establish a committee that anything you put on that web site will have to receive the approval of the majority of that committee - this all takes time. I am also aware that many committee members are also members of this forum - "Are you a member?" provides the proof of that - so information relating to the BRS activities can be passed rapidly to the committee and "on-line" decisions can be made in hours rather than weeks.

You have said "However I find it difficult to imagine any agreement being reached that would not benefit the Expat community." and I ask how would you know? How many people are in the "Ex-Pat" community compared to how many of them are BRS members? Let us say that there are 15,000 Ex-Pats and that 1000 of them are BRS members. Just as an hypothetical example: The latest agreement reached with the government is that all Ex-Pats must own property, have a deposit of £100,000.00 in a local bank and have ten years of residency stamps in their passports before they can apply for the mythical White Card! Would the other 14,000 Ex-Pat, none BRS members, be happy with that and would it benefit them? Who would know unless they were all asked before the hypothetical agreement was agreed?

Can you honestly tell me that this is true representation of the Ex-Pat wishes?

Again I say - I am not trying to undermine the BRS, I am trying to get them out from under their rock and be more open to the community they state they either represent directly or will assist if they can! You can not stop news, if you try it becomes rumor and that is a dangerous thing.
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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by 3dognight »

The BRS has taken a bit of knocking on the forum in the last week or so from the usual suspects.

There has been some ill-informed comment and some silly rudeness as well as a ‘true kibkommer’ publicly identifying a non-committee member, thereby stripping her of her anonymity without her consent; something I would have thought was wholly unnecessary, wholly unjustified and against the spirit and rules of the forum.

For the benefit of doubt, The BRS is not a business but a non-trading society and it is registered as such by the TRNC Government. It is nonsense to suggest otherwise. It was established in 1975 to advise and assist its members, to make representation on their behalf to the authorities and to foster friendly and harmonious relations with the people of Cyprus. Its committee comprises 10 unpaid volunteers who give a great deal of their time and energy to meet the aims of the society. In addition to its Chairman, Treasurer and Secretary, it has a government liaison team of two, and members who deal with membership, property issues, events, website and information and health and welfare. The BRS Committee is always looking for new members willing to join them or become sub-committee members or become area representatives. Those wishing to know more should contact the Chairman via the website.

The accounts are independently audited in January each year and the AGM is held annually in April.

Why do people join the BRS? Some reasons are:

• It is a one-stop shop for information and advice on property, health, residency, car ownership, driving etc.
• Its offers a members discount scheme covering shops, hotels, services and hospitals.
• It organises a number of social events throughout the year – a perfect opportunity to have fun and meet new friends.
• Its small government liaison team champions the ex-pat community and has direct access to the British High Commissioner, the Turkish Ambassador and to the TRNC Government, including the Prime Minister.
• It runs a TRNC wide blood donor service for members and the wider ex-pat community.
• It is currently in negotiation with the UK government with regard to NHS provision to British expats living in North Cyprus.

And the fee – currently TL 30.00 per member per year.

As for reporting information on recent meetings with government officials, far from not being transparent, the BRS has published two recent articles in Cyprus Today giving the widest possible publicity to meetings with the Turkish Ambassador and President Akinci.

On Monday this week the BRS met with the British High Commissioner in advance of his meeting in London today with the UK Prime Minister and the Greek Cypriot leader Anastasiades.

As this planned series of three meetings is now concluded, the BRS Government Liaison Team is now in a good position to offer informed thoughts and opinions as to the current state of negotiations between north and south Cyprus, and to answer questions, and to facilitate this the BRS will now host two membership sessions. The first will take place at the Pia Bella, Girne, on Thursday 24th September and the second at Stevie’s Bar, Kucuk, Erenkoy, on Thursday 1st October. Both sessions will begin at 5.00 pm and tea and coffee will be available.

Sessions will be open to all BRS members in possession of their 2015 Membership Card.

New members and non-members who wish to attend should re-join/join at The Hut, behind the post office in Girne or Lambousa Market, LAPTA between 10.00 am and 12.00 midday tomorrow.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by PoshinDevon »

Firstly, I do not class myself as one of the "usual" suspects giving the BRS a bit of a bashing.

I was one of those who just over a couple of years ago was seriously considering joining the BRS as I believd that becoming a member could indeed be beneficial. However; being somewhat cautious and not keen on being part of an ex pat club I decided to look at the website to see what benefit a member would bring. At the same time I then began to read and hear about the ill fated AGM which has caused much angst and division between members. Whilst I was not at the AGM the information following the meeting raised concerns as to what type of organisation was I thinking of joining. My understanding; which as an outsider, could well be incorrect is that the rumblings and discontent following this AGM still rumbles on. Not good for someone thinking of joining.

Now whilst the BRS do provide a one stop shop and website for queries, a large amount of this information can be found from many other sources....albeit it may take some time or research. As an example a simple query posted here on Kibkom re the MOT process elicited an almost immediate response confirming how the process worked.

I then looked at other organisations and what support they offered and again found that they seemed more open and transparent and not surrounded by " members only" can access information. Yes the BRS represent their members but they also do represent other British residents in the TRNC simply because whatever agreements they may gain from the TRNC government or authorities are not restricted to BRS members but available to other residents as well.

I am not anti the BRS just concerned as to why the rumblings from the AGM of 2 years ago have not been resolved, the non transparency and exactly what is the real benefits for joining. Over the next few years I may gain more understanding of the BRS and decide to join, but for now there are to many unknowns. The BRS do need to look at the PR side of the organisation if they are to attract those like me who hold concerns.
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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Keithcaley »

3dognight, I read your post with interest, but I have a question for you: - "Who are you?"

You choose to conceal your identity, as is your right, but the consequence of that is, because we don't know who you are, or with what authority you speak, the things that you say are de-valued.

Anyone is free to air their views on here, and in my opinion and experience, the posts which carry the most weight are those from known, trusted sources.

My name is known, my email address and telephone number are plastered all over the Forum, and I have described in detail where I live, and my background.

I am fully accountable for what I write.

When I make a mistake, I endeavour to correct it.

If I slight someone, or upset them, then I apologise.

If someone asks me a question, I do my best to answer it in a truthful and open manner.

On the other hand we have no idea of the provenance of your statement, and your post could be a complete work of fiction for all we know. We have no idea of your Nationality, Affiliations, Background, whether or not you are a BRS Member, or a Committee / sub-Committee Member, and whether or not you speak with the authority of the BRS, or whether you are just 'shooting the breeze'.

Now, to address the points which you have made regarding this 'thread' -

You say "The BRS has taken a bit of knocking on the forum in the last week or so from the 'usual suspects'."

Who? - do you mean me? - if so, why not say so? - or do you prefer to 'fudge' the issue by making vague statements for which you cannot be held accountable?

You say "There has been some ill-informed comment..."

If any comments are 'ill-informed', it is for the very reason stated by others - the BRS has appeared to prefer to keep the information to itself.

You refer to "...a ‘true kibkommer’ publicly identifying a non-committee member, thereby stripping her of her anonymity without her consent..."

This is a totally misleading statement, and you should apologise, and retract it -

If by true kibkomer', you mean me, then say so.

I did not strip 'Bertie' of her anonymity - her identity can be seen by all and sundry on her Profile page, just as mine can (but unlike yours), because she chose to make that information publicly available: -
Bertie Profile.jpg
To refer to 'Bertie' as a 'non-Committee Member' is, at best, less than the whole truth - her name is published on the BRS Website page headed 'Committee', and she is listed as a sub Committee Member: -
BRS Committee Members.jpg
I apologise for the (very) slight inaccuracy.

Far from being 'against the spirit and rules of the forum', it is entirely consistent to post publicly available information, and by that means add weight - or otherwise - to the statements made.

As for the rest of your post, I have no argument with it, save to say that we don't know how accurate your statements are, and with whose authority you speak, what your motives are, or indeed, WHO you are...

If the BRS were to create a Profile - which would be 'Verified' by the Board owner or Moderators, then statements made using that Profile would be credible and attributable.

It may not be the way that communications have been handled in the past, but we're not living in the past!

I might add that, with the notable exception of 'cambridge', those members and 'supposed members' of BRS who have posted on this thread, have chosen to not answer the direct questions put to them.

I wish you & the BRS well.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by waddo »

I second your statements Keith, in particular that information in the Public Domain is exactly that, it is public information available to all, anyone who is a user of Facebook must understand that at the very least!

As for the "Usual Suspects" I would be happy to see who is classed as such. As for the BRS taking a knocking, please explain where and when, if I, in particular, have "Knocked" then I would be happy to apologize.

I have concern with the comment made by 3dognight that the comment posted by the True Kibkomer was "wholly unjustified and against the spirit and rules of the forum". Perhaps the reply from Posh may have calmed your fears as Posh is in fact a moderator of this forum and well known for his ability to remove posts that are against the spirit and rules! However, the comment was left in place, which can only indicate that it was acceptable.

I support Keith and his idea of a BRS profile on this forum, if nothing else it would provide the BRS with a free outlet for news items that are otherwise confined to restricted distribution via the Cyprus Today paper that these days has a diminishing readership. It would also heighten the presence of the BRS and perhaps persuade other people to join. Remember the old saying that there is no such thing as bad publicity, it is always true.
No matter how hard the past, you can always begin again.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by PoshinDevon »

Hi all,

Majority of postings on this thread have been placed in good faith and in my opinion add to the discussion/debate.

I have gone in and amended one posting slightly by keithcaley....it is only very slightly amended and does not change the original posting in my opinion.

As most people know the moderators are not permanently on line and sometimes things are missed.....or may take time to be reviewed so apologies for this.

It appears that the posting 40 does give a good explanation of how much information is out in the public domain and can be easily found by anyone. Whilst I prefer openness and transparency, some people may feel that they may want to review the information on Kibkom that they entered when they signed up as a member.

There are obvious disagreements about the role of the BRS and it is to the credit of the contributors on both sides of the debate that they are attempting to put forward their responses in a sensible manner so there is no reason to not let things run.
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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Ragged Robin »

Well, I for one , am not "knocking" the BRS. I am simply asking them for more transparency when they enter into negotiations which may effect the majority of expat residents who for one reason or another are not members.

The post by 3dognight unfortunately simply endorses my concerns: in order to find out what is happening on something which could seriously affect most of our futures, we have to (a) pay to join an organisation before we are told what it does, and (b) to able to attend at specific times. It is too late for some anyone, I for example because of other commitments did not even see the post before midday today!

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by PoshinDevon »

cambridge wrote:First things first. The BRS represents its' members and attempts to represent them on issues taking place in TRNC that may well affect them. It does not represent any person who is not a member. However if any agreement that they manage to make they are happy that non members may get the benefit. See the press release in relation the meetings held with the President and Government. Not a great deal to announce officially but to get 40mins of the Presidents time is an achievement.
If you are not a member why try to undermine them? They do not represent you or claim to.
If you are a member and you are not happy find yourself a rep. or go on the web site to voice your opinion. They always welcome help & experience.
BTW I am only a member nothing to do with them as a group. Just think I am better off as a member than not.

The BRS may represent just its members on individual member issues...if in fact they do this.

However; whether a member or not, the BRS does in its current form represent everyone, particularly the british community, who may or may not be members. Any agreement or concessions gained by the BRS with regards to discounts are rightly available to BRS members only, however if its an agreement with the TRNC authorities or government is made then this impacts everyone and is not confined to BRS members only. So in a roundabout way the BRS DOES represent more than just paid up members. Bit like a union representing its members.....if they negotiate a favourable pay rise, its not for union members only, it will be for all the workforce.

Think the underlying problem for some is the way the AGM of a couple of years ago was handled, many I understand walked out, was the new committee fairly and democratically elected...the fallout from this still grates with many. Plus there seems to be a general theme on lack of transparency and what are the real benefits of joining, apart from some social events and discounts.

I wish the BRS well in all they do.
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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Lottidotti »

Can I just point something out,not wishing to upset anybody as that's not allowed.But is it right that a moderator who is actively taking part in a debate can start to amend someone else's posting.Surely there is a conflict of interest and if moderation is needed it should be done by a moderator who is not actively taking part in that discussion.
Just a thought in the interest of fairness.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by PoshinDevon »

Lottidotti wrote:Can I just point something out,not wishing to upset anybody as that's not allowed.But is it right that a moderator who is actively taking part in a debate can start to amend someone else's posting.Surely there is a conflict of interest and if moderation is needed it should be done by a moderator who is not actively taking part in that discussion.
Just a thought in the interest of fairness.

There is no conflict of interest.

The reason for amending the post was because it was reported to me by a member that the original posting was in their opinion not in the spirit of the Kibkom rules. I reviewed the post which incidentally had been on the forum for a couple of days and agreed that it was not within the spirit of the forum rules. Moderators are not always on line and sometimes do miss things. Rather than just leave the original posting it was edited by deleting a couple of words.

The original poster has also been in contact with me to apologise for the words they used and agreed that the posting should be edited.

Moderators are here to fairly moderate the forum but also have the right to their own opinions to add to the debate. If a moderator steps outside the rules then both the forum owner and other moderators will quickly point out their error!

Thanks for raising the issue and I would encourage anyone who believes that a moderator has made an error to contact either the forum owner (Soner) direct or pm the moderator in question.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Lottidotti »

There is a conflict of interest if the referee ,so to speak is taking part in the game.
You amended the post at the request of a member,fine but not if you are taking part in the debate yourself.It should be referred to another moderator for an independent decision.
You say 'moderators are here to fairly moderate the forum' nothing wrong with that, unless of course you are active in the debate as it can be inferred that the moderator who has an interest in the debate has been got at to change someone's post.You may not agree with that and I am sure your intentions are honourable but some people will see it that way.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Keithcaley »

Lottidotti, you can be sure that if I felt that one of my posts (or of anyone else, come to that!) had been amended because a moderator was exercising a Partisan interest in the subject under discussion, then I would be 'shouting from the rooftops'

The moderator removed a few words, because another member reported the post, presumably because of the intemperate language that I used. He did not alter the meaning or intent of the post one jot.

As a matter of fact, I had considered reporting the post myself (I have reported my own posts in the past, but they have been left 'unmolested' on previous occasions) simply as a means of judging whether I had 'gone too far'.

I consider the quality of Moderation on this Forum to be exceptional, although I do not hesitate to PM moderators and the board owner to discuss any decisions that I feel are questionable, not just concerning my posts, but those of others also - I don't do it on the open forum (well, rarely) - as it can detract from the thread involved, and seems to frequently lead to a free-for-all. They probably groan when they see yet another one of my PM's in their inbox.

So, thank you for your concern, but I, for one, have every confidence in Posh's judgement, impartiality, and openness - after all, he did announce what he'd done, when he could have simply done it, and said nothing. I think that that speaks volumes!

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by PoshinDevon »

Lottidotti

In order not to take this thread off topic, I have responded to your last comments via a PM.

As I have said before, if anyone has any concerns about a posting, moderators actions or just a general query about the forum the quickest way to get things looked at and resolved is by sending a pm to any moderator. It will be picked up reasonably quickly and any action as necessary will be taken.

Sometimes the sheer volume of postings due to the forums popularity does mean that moderators will sometimes miss things.

Saying that, it is not that often that moderators have to intervene which is of course a credit to all members.

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Re: The BRS Deserves Our Support

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Post by Lottidotti »

Keithcaley, My concern isn't whether you asked for your post to be amended its the fact it was altered by a moderator who is actively involved with the subject in hand.
Poshindevon,If you are OK with moderating post that you are actively taking part in instead of referring it to another moderator so be it.But don't be surprised if comments are made along the lines of 'Oh it's the old boys network,It's not what you know it's who you know if you want a post amending'.Don't get me wrong I am referring to all moderators here not just you.
I just think it's a good idea that moderators actively taking part in a particular debate should not amend another post in that debate.If there are any concerns about a post it should be passed to another moderator not involved.
By doing that it would protect the moderators from the type of comments above and provide the poster peace of mind that a post has not been removed because the moderator involved in that discussion didn't like what a poster says.
In relation to taking this off topic,Really! I think there are some similarities.

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