The Brexit effect

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Thu 04 Feb 2021 8:51 pm

However, The UK economic woes remain in a sorry state. The Irish problem upon borders, absence of planning and a failure upon the deal that was agreed are causing some very worrying signals including a possible break down of the GF peace agreement.

I have highlighted the industrial sectors being badly effected as a result of loss of trade ,and they are still in turmoil... vaccine or not.
Is this a cause for celebration?
I think not.
Quite shameful

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by waz-24-7 »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Thu 04 Feb 2021 11:24 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Thu 04 Feb 2021 8:35 pm

Is this a cause for celebration?
I think not.
Quite shameful
I think the virtue signalling would be better from someone who doesn’t glory in every piece of bad news in the U.K. tbh
I think that if you read more carefully some posts you will see credit where credit is due. For example the success of vaccine roll out within the UK.
Yes there is a high level of bad news right now. Yes we agree on that.
Surely you have seen in news media the issues and difficulties being experience right now my many business sectors within the UK.

The challenge I have put up is simple. What is our government doing about the mess. Given Mr Johnson in part led the Brexit campaign. Is it not reasonable that we demand some action to save the businesses that are shackled into the rubbish deal he signed us into.

Now if someone can please, yet again, provide some real positives (bar the vaccine roll out) then I am all ears.

So yes the bad news is there because it is frankly yes BAD news. No glory in that just plain and simply that's where we are and it needs urgent attention.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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waz-24-7 wrote:
Thu 04 Feb 2021 11:39 pm

The challenge I have put up is simple. What is our government doing about the mess. Given Mr Johnson in part led the Brexit campaign. Is it not reasonable that we demand some action to save the businesses that are shackled into the rubbish deal he signed us into.
You are a one subject obsessive.
We have a little matter of covid which I think may be taking up a bit of the government’s focus at the moment.
Tbh Waz you strike me as the sort who if we were given a 12 hour warning that an asteroid was going to hit the earth would say “well that’s all well and good and a bit of a shame but are we going to deal with the fact that I now have to fill in an EU form 12973B?”

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by waz-24-7 »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Thu 04 Feb 2021 11:50 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Thu 04 Feb 2021 11:39 pm

The challenge I have put up is simple. What is our government doing about the mess. Given Mr Johnson in part led the Brexit campaign. Is it not reasonable that we demand some action to save the businesses that are shackled into the rubbish deal he signed us into.
You are a one subject obsessive.
We have a little matter of covid which I think may be taking up a bit of the government’s focus at the moment.
Tbh Waz you strike me as the sort who if we were given a 12 hour warning that an asteroid was going to hit the earth would say “well that’s all well and good and a bit of a shame but are we going to deal with the fact that I now have to fill in an EU form 12973B?”
Not interested in asteroid strikes or what I may or may not do.
You clearly are one of those that take the view our government can do no wrong.
Yes of course the government has COVID to deal with just like the rest of the Globe.
That does not however (in my book) pardon them in sorting out the current Irish melt down issue. Saving the industrial sectors that are being restricted from running businesses that are the mainstay of the British economy which incidentally is in recession.

Once again Mr Johnson....Do something because you took us here!! OR Do nothing. At least some ( on distant shores) will keep supporting you no matter what you do.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by PoshinDevon »

Waz

Firstly at the sake of being repetitive a deal has been done with the EU. I may not like elements of it and of course you certainly don’t. However the deal was agreed and signed by both sides. Now often when a deal or let’s say contract is signed it does take time for things to bed in whilst all parties involved strive to ensure that it works. There will be tweaks and changes to the deal in the future for sure.

Sadly you are someone who will never accept the deal and will continue to moan about paperwork and how much extra work you personally have to do. You will always find a negative out of a positive. For example trade deals large and small being signed or negotiated being brushed aside as somewhat irrelevant in your opinion.

We are just one month in to this new trading relationship, with a world pandemic happening and every country trying to protect there economy and there citizens.

I think you may have to sit back and be patient for a while yet.
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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by waz-24-7 »

PoshinDevon wrote:
Fri 05 Feb 2021 7:47 am
Waz

Firstly at the sake of being repetitive a deal has been done with the EU. I may not like elements of it and of course you certainly don’t. However the deal was agreed and signed by both sides. Now often when a deal or let’s say contract is signed it does take time for things to bed in whilst all parties involved strive to ensure that it works. There will be tweaks and changes to the deal in the future for sure.

Sadly you are someone who will never accept the deal and will continue to moan about paperwork and how much extra work you personally have to do. You will always find a negative out of a positive. For example trade deals large and small being signed or negotiated being brushed aside as somewhat irrelevant in your opinion.

We are just one month in to this new trading relationship, with a world pandemic happening and every country trying to protect there economy and there citizens.

I think you may have to sit back and be patient for a while yet.
Posh
We are of course aware of our opposing positions.
You and I are forced to accept the deal. Neither you nor I had any choice in the matter. You clearly voted for it even though you knew nothing about its content or onward consequences .
Many scholars made very clear the consequences and generally these were ignored. There are very small elements of economic positivity as you point out, such as requests and applications for trade deals with some countries. I have been on the DTI international trade webinar past few weeks and believe me whilst efforts are being made the progress towards securing deals and securing prosperity is desperately slow and inadequate. All whilst UK businesses are thrust into alien status with WTO protocols that the UK has not been in for 40 years. That is not good.
Furthermore:
You will be aware of the inevitable turmoil within Ireland on the hard boarder and customs issues. Do you have a solution to assist me in accepting the consequences that were highlighted years ago. The failure of the good Friday agreement upon peace would in my view be catastrophic. This also is not good and finding a positive is difficult particularly if you are one of the consequences.

Of course we are now outside the EU and the UK will survive. I once again call on our Government (particularly Boris Brexit) to account for the complete failure in planning and strategy and leaving the UK export economy in a state of total disarray.
Patient, yes I am. and I am lucky. However, Tell that to the farmers, fishermen and businesses that are already struggling and in immediate loss. They have little time to be patient. They only want to survive.
1 trillion £ and 10,000 finance jobs have gone offshore already
Last edited by waz-24-7 on Fri 05 Feb 2021 7:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by PoshinDevon »

I voted to leave the EU. That has happened.

We have an agreed deal. That in my opinion is good.

The U.K. is striking trade deals almost weekly with countries outside the EU (You continue to fail to acknowledge this). That again is a good thing.

The deal has been in place for 1 month only. There were always going to be some who would be disappointed with any deal, I acknowledge this.

However, whilst you wallow in the negativity, I continue to see a brighter future.

Finally, I have a number of friends in senior positions in companies and one a CEO. I have kept in touch with them and whilst one has said yes working with his EU trade partners there is extra paperwork to be completed. However; providing you plan appropriately in advance this is not to onerous a task. Another has advised they started exploring alternative markets over a year ago and the business is growing (Electronics). They also said the vast majority of the problems they have experienced isn’t as a result of Brexit but due to Covid restrictions ( Companies they deal with having reduced production due to there own supply issues).

I am sure you can find companies in opposing positions; as you would, but trying to say it’s all doom and gloom is wrong.
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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by waz-24-7 »

PoshinDevon wrote:
Fri 05 Feb 2021 7:20 pm
I voted to leave the EU. That has happened.

We have an agreed deal. That in my opinion is good.

The U.K. is striking trade deals almost weekly with countries outside the EU (You continue to fail to acknowledge this). That again is a good thing.

The deal has been in place for 1 month only. There were always going to be some who would be disappointed with any deal, I acknowledge this.

However, whilst you wallow in the negativity, I continue to see a brighter future.

Finally, I have a number of friends in senior positions in companies and one a CEO. I have kept in touch with them and whilst one has said yes working with his EU trade partners there is extra paperwork to be completed. However; providing you plan appropriately in advance this is not to onerous a task. Another has advised they started exploring alternative markets over a year ago and the business is growing (Electronics). They s as Lao said the vast majority of the problems they have experienced isn’t as a result of Brexit but due to Covid restrictions ( Companies they deal with having reduced production).

I am sure you can find companies in opposing positions, as you would but trying to say it’s all doom and gloom is wrong.
Okay
Whilst you also wallow in your positivity.
It appears clear that your are not economically negatively effected.
Certainly many businesses are stepping up. I tick that box tho the costs and haste is something thrust upon me against my will. Certainly there are many businesses that are not like the one you refer too. success of any UK business is good and it is certainly not all doom and gloom.
I simply ask you what benefits from your vote can I expect going forward and how is the UK government going to make these positives happen and work? The we won so shut up and put up is simply not good enough.

Given it is now all done and dusted.
Is it not reasonable to insist that all the NEW trade deals be in place before the divorce; instead of the panic mode we find ourselves in. Is it not unreasonable that the industries that I have referred too, be "ready" for the new protocols? Is it not reasonable for the people of Northern Island to have the hard won security of the GF agreement to be upheld and kept sacred. The list of failures goes on.

Yes ,I struggle to wallow in your positivity. I feel for those that are immediately in loss because of poor preparation and poor leadership.
Brexit Boris must take responsibility and address the issues . I think the Covid screen blows smoke over the problem. Post Covid I hope your promise of more new trade deals and unprecedented new orders from far distant shores proves me wrong and all the fishermen and performers and financial businesses and thousands of businesses in Brexit loss can prosper. I hope the £ trillion lost revenue and 10,oo jobs from financial services can be won back and pushed forward.

And that's besides all the more personel issues upon freedoms of travel, visas , insurance , healthcare , security etc. loss of EU citizenship.
Hey but its great to be British, but wait …. just like I always have been!!

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by kerry 6138 »

https://metro.co.uk/2021/02/05/cadbury- ... -14026912/

The owner of Cadbury is to bring more of its Dairy Milk production back to its historic Bournville factory in the UK from Europe.

Wallow in positivity or negativity if you want, I'll stick to chocolate.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by waz-24-7 »

kerry 6138 wrote:
Fri 05 Feb 2021 11:10 pm
https://metro.co.uk/2021/02/05/cadbury- ... -14026912/

The owner of Cadbury is to bring more of its Dairy Milk production back to its historic Bournville factory in the UK from Europe.

Wallow in positivity or negativity if you want, I'll stick to chocolate.
Yes
I saw this on the news today and that is good news in terms of investment for Birmingham . I'm not sure upon employment numbers and the reason for moving is not published . Cadburys has lost significant market share for its products in recent years and the business has changed hands. It is USA owned. .Chocolate generally as a sugary sweet has lost credibility. There has been a decline in demand and of course coming back to its roots is the obvious move for this British icon which generally is still the major brand within the UK.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Fri 05 Feb 2021 11:38 pm

Chocolate generally as a sugary sweet has lost credibility. There has been a decline in demand
Been doing ok the last few years
AEA04BF9-6BEF-4055-B9FC-7C82EFB7F44A.jpeg

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by Hedge-fund »

Hedge-fund wrote:
Fri 29 Jan 2021 7:20 pm
If we were still in the eu we would be in a similar position to the 'countries' that are in it. Desperately short of vaccines and unable to vote out the eu incompetents that put them in this position.

I hope at some stage the UK can bring the oxford vaccine to Cyprus and dish it out in the SBAs to
Expats, Cypriots and mainlanders.

The UK flew the vaccine to the Falklands this week and covered the islanders.

I'm sure they are doing the SBAs as we speak.

Within a month I'm sure the UK will have more vaccine than it needs/can use so there's no reason it can't do as suggested in Eire and TRNC.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by waz-24-7 »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Fri 05 Feb 2021 11:53 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Fri 05 Feb 2021 11:38 pm

Chocolate generally as a sugary sweet has lost credibility. There has been a decline in demand
Been doing ok the last few years
AEA04BF9-6BEF-4055-B9FC-7C82EFB7F44A.jpeg
Thank you for the research.
The UK market remains more buoyant than many other markets. Chocolate globally has declined as 10 yr commodity prices show.

Kraft disposed of the Cadbury brand to current owners 2 yrs ago . The brand has been under attack form USA and European brands for some time.
The UK remains the brand stronghold after European and USA campaigns failed to meet expectations..
My guess is that the move back to UK is based on market forces, UK demand and a decline in market share outside the UK
I do not think for a moment this is anything to do with Brexit.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by PoshinDevon »

Waz

It is clear that much of what you write is all about “you”, your so called companies and your own interests. Nothing will satisfy you until the U.K. rejoins the club we have just left. You are going to remain sad, angry and negative for a long time with all your demands.

Like I mentioned my contacts in industry and the commercial world are rising to the challenge and in the way we British often do...... getting on with it positively. I will take their positivity and happily “wallow” in it.
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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by waz-24-7 »

PoshinDevon wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 9:00 am
Waz

It is clear that much of what you write is all about “you”, your so called companies and your own interests. Nothing will satisfy you until the U.K. rejoins the club we have just left. You are going to remain sad, angry and negative for a long time with all your demands.

Like I mentioned my contacts in industry and the commercial world are rising to the challenge and in the way we British often do...... getting on with it positively. I will take their positivity and happily “wallow” in it.
I think you are mistaken.
I too am rising to the challenges thrust open me. Rising to challenges do not guarantee success. Any business that had clear plan and focus four years ago that has been forced to change tack for no quantifiable benefit should be dissatisfied with government.

A rejoin is sometime off without doubt. You should be aware via my posts my demand is quire simple. That Brexit Boris also steps up and faces the challenge in putting right the damage to thousands of businesses not quite so lucky as me and yours. I still see massive (Brexit) loss as this year progresses . He must also deliver upon his promises made to us all during his campaign to leave. I guess we wont see the millions of Turkish lining up on UK borders.
Furthermore :
I don't believe UK citizens can win back lost privileges or costs of being non European . These loses are again thrust upon me with no quantifiable advantage. I feel absolutely no more British than I did for years ago.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by Hedge-fund »

Hedge-fund wrote:
Fri 05 Feb 2021 11:58 pm
Hedge-fund wrote:
Fri 29 Jan 2021 7:20 pm
If we were still in the eu we would be in a similar position to the 'countries' that are in it. Desperately short of vaccines and unable to vote out the eu incompetents that put them in this position.

I hope at some stage the UK can bring the oxford vaccine to Cyprus and dish it out in the SBAs to
Expats, Cypriots and mainlanders.

The UK flew the vaccine to the Falklands this week and covered the islanders.

I'm sure they are doing the SBAs as we speak.

Within a month I'm sure the UK will have more vaccine than it needs/can use so there's no reason it can't do as suggested in Eire and TRNC.
Looks like Tatar brought this very issue up when meeting the Uk Foreign Secretary this week.

https://www.lgcnews.com/tatar-meets-bri ... iety-reps/

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 11:33 am

You should be aware via my posts my demand is quire simple. That Brexit Boris also steps up and faces the challenge in putting right the damage to thousands of businesses not quite so lucky as me and yours.
It's called prioritising not everyone is a one subject obsessive like you. His priority is covid. Remember asteroid hitting the earth versus I'm struggling to source Brie??
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 11:33 am


I still see massive (Brexit) loss as this year progresses .
No you see the opportunity to blame the cost of the lockdown on Brexit.
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 11:33 am


I guess we wont see the millions of Turkish lining up on UK borders.
I know now we wont see a policy brought in by an unelected quango effect us
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 11:33 am


I feel absolutely no more British than I did for years ago.
I don't feel any less European than I did years ago I just feel I have finally managed to cancel my subscription to a dodgy book of the month club I was duped into joining years ago

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by waz-24-7 »

ETS
If you do not feel any less European then I can only guess your travel plans are very limited and that your trips into the ROC for example will no longer matter or be of importance. You clearly are outside of the work for a living book club.

In the TRNC which I presume is your chosen offshore home. Have you ever wondered ...why do many indigenous Turkish Cypriots travel south to secure their free issue European passports. Not because they love the ROC. No ...because they can capitalise on the rights and privileges that being European awards. You are living amongst Europeans that you clearly have distain for.

Do they know something you do not or are they somewhat more switched on.
I feel less European certainly. I feel I am in a weaker place than I was before. Have I noticed the new found freedoms, trade and new money post Brexit. Absolutely not
As for leaving your book club. Are there any other book clubs available? perhaps we can become part of the USA. I guess ..You can of course restrict yourself to British authors and scholars only because in your book that represents no loss at all.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by Walesforever »

Waz,

You are just like a broken record.


Tell me this.....what actual benefits did you assume would happen in the first 5 weeks of Brexit? You have just said you haven’t seen any new benefits since Brexit!! Yet you care not to debate the vaccine programme. Is this because it doesn’t suit your anti Brexit agenda?
Only today a leading German MP has come out heavily criticising the EU and the way it’s shambolic handling of the whole vaccine program.
The main reason it’s been such a shambles is the huge amount of beurocracy attached to it.

In the middle of this monumental World struggle Britain is leading the way ( you brush this off) and come back with Britain’s death toll. Yet London is the top stopover in the World. The uk had over 60 million more people come through its borders than France yet France isn’t that far behind the UK and it’s numbers are still increasing.
No European Country gets anywhere near the numbers of people through its borders that the UK get.
Could we have done better? Yes absolutely....and now we are doing better....!!!

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 6:08 pm

ETS
If you do not feel any less European then I can only guess your travel plans are very limited and that your trips into the ROC for example will no longer matter or be of importance.
Travelling to the ROC is problematical due to the Cyprus situation a situation that the EU had an opportunity to make a difference to but dropped the ball.
As for any other country in Europe once the covid problem is solved then I will be free to travel to them as I did before. I think even the most lying of the remainers doesn’t keep that lie going.
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 6:08 pm

You are living amongst Europeans that you clearly have distain for.
I don’t have any disdain for Europeans I just like to be governed by people I can vote out
Last edited by EnjoyingTheSun on Sat 06 Feb 2021 9:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by waz-24-7 »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 9:51 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 6:08 pm

ETS
If you do not feel any less European then I can only guess your travel plans are very limited and that your trips into the ROC for example will no longer matter or be of importance.
Travelling to the ROC is problematical due to the Cyprus situation a situation that the EU had an opportunity to make a difference to but dropped the ball.
As for any other country in Europe once the covid problem is solved then I will be free to travel to them as I did before. I think even the most lying of the remainers doesn’t keep that lie going.
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 6:08 pm

You are living amongst Europeans that you clearly have distain for.
I don’t have any disdain for Europeans I just like to be governed by people I can vote out
Perhaps you would explain to me how you will be free to travel within the EU "just as you were before".
What precisely is the lie you refer to.
Did you not pick up on the freedom of movement clause that was NOT peddled by Mr Farage..

You can vote out the UK Government in the next election!!

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 11:20 pm

Perhaps you would explain to me how you will be free to travel within the EU "just as you were before".
Assuming covid is done It’s quite simple.

You buy a ticket
On the day of the flight you turn up at the airport a couple of hours before the flight leaves.
Don’t forget your passport.
Depending on where you are going and the country’s rules you might need to fill in a visa thing on the plane but don’t worry it takes about 3 minutes.

Unless you are saying I can’t visit France, Germany, Spain, Italy etc????

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 11:20 pm

You can vote out the UK Government in the next election!!
Yep that’s it, you’re getting the hang of it now. We give a government 5 years and if we are pleased with the direction they are going we vote them in again. If not we try someone else.

I know you are an expert on the EU so I’m asking you for a German friend, when can he vote on Ursula von der Leyen’s successor and who are the possible candidates?

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by Mowgli597 »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 9:54 am
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 11:20 pm

You can vote out the UK Government in the next election!!
I know you are an expert on the EU so I’m asking you for a German friend, when can he vote on Ursula von der Leyen’s successor and who are the possible candidates?
But when can you vote for Boris Johnson’s successor if the members of his parliamentary party decide they want rid of him (a la T May, for example) and who are the candidates for whom you could vote?

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by waz-24-7 »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 9:46 am
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 11:20 pm

Perhaps you would explain to me how you will be free to travel within the EU "just as you were before".
Assuming covid is done It’s quite simple.

You buy a ticket
On the day of the flight you turn up at the airport a couple of hours before the flight leaves.
Don’t forget your passport.
Depending on where you are going and the country’s rules you might need to fill in a visa thing on the plane but don’t worry it takes about 3 minutes.

Unless you are saying I can’t visit France, Germany, Spain, Italy etc????
Great you're getting it now,
So you have to apply for a visa. I whish it was as simple as you say? You no longer have right of entry or passage because you have forfeited that right. For Cyprus particularly...If you happen to land in ROC and want to go north as many do. I would expect occasionally you will get stopped and even possibly imprisoned. That should be plain and clear to you. That's another positive you voted for.
Of course if you happen to want to drive across Europe then of course green card insurance, driving license and health care issues are all but only another 3 minutes plus that couple of hours of course. I think not.
So much positive you have thrust upon me!!

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Mowgli597 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 11:54 am
EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 9:54 am
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 11:20 pm

You can vote out the UK Government in the next election!!
I know you are an expert on the EU so I’m asking you for a German friend, when can he vote on Ursula von der Leyen’s successor and who are the possible candidates?
But when can you vote for Boris Johnson’s successor if the members of his parliamentary party decide they want rid of him (a la T May, for example) and who are the candidates for whom you could vote?
I guess your German friend could use the German democratic system to answer that. If he doesn't quite like it then of course democratic process can always find a way....look what Brexit did for the UK.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Mowgli597 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 11:54 am
EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 9:54 am
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 06 Feb 2021 11:20 pm

You can vote out the UK Government in the next election!!
I know you are an expert on the EU so I’m asking you for a German friend, when can he vote on Ursula von der Leyen’s successor and who are the possible candidates?
But when can you vote for Boris Johnson’s successor if the members of his parliamentary party decide they want rid of him (a la T May, for example) and who are the candidates for whom you could vote?
Or Brown, Callaghan or Major, I'm sure you didn't mean to forget them. Or Livingstone of course :)
Most people generally vote for a party rather than a leader and if the leader doesn't suit you get the chance to boot them at the next election.

Personally I do think when a leader changes they should seek election as some leaders might attract votes personally. Thatcher was a very polarising figure but some did vote for her rather than the Tories. The Conservatives will ruthlessly chop a leader if they feel the leader is losing the electorate.
The thing is when our parties do change leader you have at least heard of the next leader. The party will choose a leader who they feel will attract votes at the next election.
Hands up who could pick Ursula von der Leyen out of a line up now, let alone pre 2019.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 12:12 pm

So you have to apply for a visa. I whish it was as simple as you say?
So you have to go to the French embassy in London and queue up for hours now?
We have gone back in a time machine to the 1920s?
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 12:12 pm

For Cyprus particularly...If you happen to land in ROC and want to go north as many do. I would expect occasionally you will get stopped and even possibly imprisoned.
Cyprus is obviously a fairly unique example due to reasons already ignored by you
Just imprisoned??? Not machine gunned down at the border?? Come on Waz run with this nonsense.
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 12:12 pm

Of course if you happen to want to drive across Europe then of course green card insurance, driving license and health care issues
Well if that's your intention your driving license will be ok and at worst you could of course get car and health insurance. And the vast majority who don't won't have to pay millions in taxes to subsidise those from 30 other countries that do.
None of these things are free Waz.
I might not use the NHS but am happy to pay to support it for those that do.
Subsidising a family's multi-centre driving holiday, not so much.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

Waz you seem not to grasp the free stuff concept.
If you are a net contributor to the EU then you aren't getting free stuff.
The EU as a body does not have it's own money.
It helps itself to the money from some of the countries who are members of it.
The governments of those countries do not have their own money either, they help themselves to their population's money. This is called tax.

So when you think I only paid for third party insurance but the EU generously upgraded it to fully comp for free, they didn't. Ultimately either they moved some of your tax money to upgrade you or some of someone else's tax money to upgrade you.
Same principle when the EU pay for a swimming pool in Wales. No. Some people in Wales or elsewhere in the UK paid for that swimming pool.
The way the EU get involved is by collecting the money and distributing the money less a large handling charge and deciding that a 5th swimming pool with an EU plaque was needed as opposed to the school that the people in that town in Wales actually really wanted.
Until you grasp this, what I would hope was a very simple concept, it is a waste of time discussing this with you.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by waz-24-7 »

ETS
You are fully aware of my position as I am of yours.
The new difficulties thrust upon me and indeed you appear not to effect you as they do me and others. I firmly believe the issues I have highlighted as a result of leaving the non perfect EU will cost the UK dearly for many years. Perhaps the UK will eventually emerge prosperous and better off. I would willingly accept that if a clear plan and strategy was in place. It is not and when people harp on about new trade deals; it is encouraging but that is then and not NOW . What do we do whilst we wait for the deals?
Today we hear that UK exports to the EU are down a massive 68%. How can that be in anyway a good result. New trade deals will not cover the immediate loss. Business loss and failures are very much on the cards whilst these losses are weighed in.

Your take upon personel changes to visas, insurance, security and freedoms does not convince me that I am better off. I doubt anyone, particularly ex pats living in the EU would either.
If you can offer me any positives that will make me at least feel encouraged then I am all ears.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 1:43 pm

Today we hear that UK exports to the EU are down a massive 68%.
And EU imports?
And our other exports elsewhere in the world that doesn't exist in your mind.

Anyhow I think I might know something about that

Give me a C
Give me an O
Give me a V..........

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by PoshinDevon »

Waz

Over the last few weeks a number of positives have been mentioned but I think many of us realise that it is a waste of time trying to mention any positives to you as you simply ignore them.

Having read your last couple of posts re travel, visas, crossing borders etc, you make it sound as if it’s going to be fraught with problems. It is simply not the case.

Please don’t go on about Cyprus and border crossings as many of us fully understand the situation. Maybe the ROC will allow travel via Larnaca/Paphos or a port up to the TRNC and maybe they might make things difficult. We simply do not know and to be honest there has always been a possibility of a problem on arrival in the ROC or on occasions crossing the border. The majority of us will adapt our plans to meet the situation.

As for travel within Europe itself, I see no real problems for those who plan and are properly prepared. Whether that be driving licences, insurance etc. Do remember the french when feeling a bit belligerent have always had a knack of stopping GB plated vehicles to check they have spare light bulbs, warning triangles, first aid kits etc etc.

We are a month into a new relationship with the EU and like every new relationship it will take time to settle down. I am sure that over time we will run along just fine.....providing you have of course planned properly. Despite what you are saying, my contacts in a number of companies are concentrating on the future and are making things work with there EU trading partners.
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Re: The Brexit effect

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waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 1:43 pm

I would willingly accept that if a clear plan and strategy was in place. It is not and when people harp on about new trade deals; it is encouraging but that is then and not NOW . What do we do whilst we wait for the deals?
Today we hear that UK exports to the EU are down a massive 68%. How can that be in anyway a good result. New trade deals will not cover the immediate loss.
Well maybe if the remainers hadn't spent four years trying to overthrow a democratic vote and tie up parliament then the government might have been able to sort more out, ever thought of that?
We only seemed to make any progress on a deal when the EU finally realised that the remainers weren't going to be able to overturn the vote.
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 1:43 pm

Your take upon personel changes to visas, insurance, security and freedoms does not convince me that I am better off. I doubt anyone, particularly ex pats living in the EU would either.
If you can offer me any positives that will make me at least feel encouraged then I am all ears.
It depends on your circumstances. Maybe you don't pay tax so get free stuff that isn't really free.
I realised that it would probably be slightly more aggravation for me personally if we left the EU but I thought it would be better for the long term future of the UK and my children or grandchildren. Sometimes people don't always vote for absolutely selfish reasons.
Why would I offer you anything, you won't listen or understand and just change the subject.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by waz-24-7 »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 2:37 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 1:43 pm

Today we hear that UK exports to the EU are down a massive 68%.
And EU imports?
And our other exports elsewhere in the world that doesn't exist in your mind.

Anyhow I think I might know something about that

Give me a C
Give me an O
Give me a V..........
EU imports. Why is that important? Possibly ...If the EU is in loss also then that makes it Okay? Oh dear.

I cannot comment upon exports to other markets as figures are not readily there until 1st quarter stats are published.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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PoshinDevon wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 2:38 pm
Waz

Over the last few weeks a number of positives have been mentioned but I think many of us realise that it is a waste of time trying to mention any positives to you as you simply ignore them.

Having read your last couple of posts re travel, visas, crossing borders etc, you make it sound as if it’s going to be fraught with problems. It is simply not the case.

Please don’t go on about Cyprus and border crossings as many of us fully understand the situation. Maybe the ROC will allow travel via Larnaca/Paphos or a port up to the TRNC and maybe they might make things difficult. We simply do not know and to be honest there has always been a possibility of a problem on arrival in the ROC or on occasions crossing the border. The majority of us will adapt our plans to meet the situation.

As for travel within Europe itself, I see no real problems for those who plan and are properly prepared. Whether that be driving licences, insurance etc. Do remember the french when feeling a bit belligerent have always had a knack of stopping GB plated vehicles to check they have spare light bulbs, warning triangles, first aid kits etc etc.

We are a month into a new relationship with the EU and like every new relationship it will take time to settle down. I am sure that over time we will run along just fine.....providing you have of course planned properly. Despite what you are saying, my contacts in a number of companies are concentrating on the future and are making things work with there EU trading partners.
Posh,
If you told me that UK exports were up 68% then that would be the best news ever on the Brexit issue. Its not though.
Upon the forfeited rights and privileges To me it will not be tremendously difficult either and certainly not fraught.. Its just a hassle that I don't really want or relish and for what?
However, We should ask and be clear. All these negatives within just weeks suggest to me and certainly to many that the cost to benefit numbers just don't add up..at the moment. What can I expect please? Will the EU market come back or will they source and trade elsewhere just like the UK intends to?
Certainly many UK businesses are trading with the EU under the new regime. The additional costs are reducing margin and logistics of delivery has added line stop scenarios that could lead to loss of business. These real issues cannot be ignored when competing for trade.
I'm afraid that in business "over time" does not pay the wages. Its simple forwards OR backwards. Currently the situation is a recovery from Covid and Brexit. Post Covid will undoubtedly launch the global economy. Is the UK ready to capitalise. Absolutely not.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 3:08 pm

EU imports. Why is that important? Possibly ...If the EU is in loss also then that makes it Okay? Oh dear.
I forgot I have to spell things out.....very......slowly....
One it would indicate whether this is a worldwide problem due to covid and zero to do with Brexit.
You know if you lockdown and stop making things you don’t have anything to sell?
Two if we are importing far less from the EU as well then the effect on our balance of payments maybe negligible and also indicate that it is again covid related.

I know you keep trying to prove I have some hatred of the EU or Europeans in general but this isn’t the case and is just to deflect from what is proving to be a pathological obsession with the wonders of the EU and the amazement that everyone else isn’t as obsessed with it as you.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 3:27 pm

If you told me that UK exports were up 68% then that would be the best news ever on the Brexit issue.
Any good news you ignore. Vaccine roll out? Nissan?
Your business isn’t going well because of Brexit? Maybe you could have made some adjustments from July 2016 rather than hoping Brexit would go away.
It goes back to saddle makers and the advent of the car. The world does not stop turning because it doesn’t suit you.
Stop snivelling about Brexit, man up, adapt and get on with it. It’s happened so get on with it.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 3:27 pm

All these negatives within just weeks suggest to me
And all together;

Give me a C
Give me an O
Give me a V..........

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Re: The Brexit effect

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EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 5:46 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 3:08 pm

EU imports. Why is that important? Possibly ...If the EU is in loss also then that makes it Okay? Oh dear.
I forgot I have to spell things out.....very......slowly....
One it would indicate whether this is a worldwide problem due to covid and zero to do with Brexit.
You know if you lockdown and stop making things you don’t have anything to sell?
Two if we are importing far less from the EU as well then the effect on our balance of payments maybe negligible and also indicate that it is again covid related.

I know you keep trying to prove I have some hatred of the EU or Europeans in general but this isn’t the case and is just to deflect from what is proving to be a pathological obsession with the wonders of the EU and the amazement that everyone else isn’t as obsessed with it as you.
I agree that the Covid effect is significant and is clouding the issue somewhat.
Speaking almost daily with businesses within the UK and of course following economic and business numbers. The Brexit effect is definitely and without doubt hitting negatively our GDP.
The combined effect of both issues is very serious. When the global economy surges after Covid. The UK must be ready. I believe it is not and the Government is doing little to prepare or plan.

Upon your points. Your economics position is nonsense. If we stop making stuff and buy nothing then we are okay? In order to prosper and pay for things like the NHS, the military and indeed government. The UK must earn offshore dollars. The balance of payments and borrowings within the UK is frightening. Post Covid, I see little change upon the deficit unless all these new markets and trade sump up sharpish.
I am willing and able to sell anything I can offshore. That is the challenge that has been made more difficult.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 5:54 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 3:27 pm

If you told me that UK exports were up 68% then that would be the best news ever on the Brexit issue.
Any good news you ignore. Vaccine roll out? Nissan?
Your business isn’t going well because of Brexit? Maybe you could have made some adjustments from July 2016 rather than hoping Brexit would go away.
It goes back to saddle makers and the advent of the car. The world does not stop turning because it doesn’t suit you.
Stop snivelling about Brexit, man up, adapt and get on with it. It’s happened so get on with it.
Sorry but you should be aware that the vaccine roll out is acknowledged as excellent news, Thank you. You know nothing of my business so please stop assuming of me.
My own business is doing fine thanks. We have not closed at all and our order book is full. It is the many other business that are in loss and cannot sell their products into the EU and are promised new trade deals are on the way. These businesses and industries are my concern together with the Irish situation that is quite shameful. Perhaps you could offer your Brexit advice and guidance to the people of Northern Island.

Please rest assured I'm "on with it" and perhaps you should lie back and enjoy the sunshine whilst the UK grafts to keep you in sunny Europe where you may enjoy your new found isolationism.
Last edited by waz-24-7 on Sun 07 Feb 2021 6:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by PoshinDevon »

Waz.... you said

“I am willing and able to sell anything I can offshore. That is the challenge that has been made more difficult.”

Rise to the challenge, stop moaning and get on with it is the best advice I can offer.

This is exactly what my friends in a variety of businesses are doing. Doing business they say is a little different; but there mantra is, if we want to trade we must adapt. None of my contacts are saying it’s so difficult as to be impossible. They continue to trade and business is good. The problems they are encountering have nothing to do with Brexit, they are due to the effect of a world wide pandemic causing both them and there trading partners to limit supply in some areas. They are confident that once the current restrictions in place throughout the EU are eased, business will pick up significantly.

Similarly for those of us travelling ; despite what you say, travelling to the EU zone really isn’t that difficult. EU residents will travel to the U.K. and U.K. residents will continue to travel to the EU. Each may have to undergo a quick check on arrival but again it isn’t an interrogation by a border guard!
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Re: The Brexit effect

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PoshinDevon wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 6:16 pm
Waz.... you said

“I am willing and able to sell anything I can offshore. That is the challenge that has been made more difficult.”

Rise to the challenge, stop moaning and get on with it is the best advice I can offer.

This is exactly what my friends in a variety of businesses are doing. Doing business they say is a little different; but there mantra is, if we want to trade we must adapt. None of my contacts are saying it’s so difficult as to be impossible.

Similarly for those of us travelling to the EU zone it really isn’t that difficult. EU residents will travel to the U.K. and U.K. residents will continue to travel to the EU.
Posh,
Please believe me. I'm on with it.
Our business continues to push on and succeed. . Certainly opportunities remain abundant for business if you have the opportunity. It is trading with Europe that currently leaves a hole in opportunities. The NEW trade deals you refer to are not in place. UK internal business has increased for me but that does not earn the critical offshore $. We have opened once again in Spain, paying Spanish tax and employing Spanish People. Our UK ex pats have been let go because they have no work permits or residency. This annoys me intensely.
Your contacts may well adapt and survive. My guess is that they , if they export to the EU, have experienced increase in costs. I don't need to explain the effect of that.

It is quite annoying that some that are not within the UK economy and have chosen to leave UK shores have the audacity to tell people like myself on how to prosper and get on with it.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 6:01 pm

Upon your points. Your economics position is nonsense. If we stop making stuff and buy nothing then we are okay? In order to prosper and pay for things like the NHS, the military and indeed government. The UK must earn offshore dollars. The balance of payments and borrowings within the UK is frightening.
Either you listen and don’t hear or you just don’t listen.
Ok to export things you have to make things, yes?
Now at the moment we aren’t making too much are we?
So if we aren’t making much we can’t sell much can we?
Now as a country we import more than we export anyhow?
So if we don’t export say £1 billion but at the same time aren’t importing £1 billion then our balance of payments isn’t unduly effected is it?
So when I ask you what the imports from the EU are all I am asking is the other half of the sum.
As for us having to earn offshore dollars to pay for our NHS please explain how a balance of payments deficit pays for the NHS?
I can see how it pays for other countries Health Services but not ours

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Re: The Brexit effect

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waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 6:13 pm

perhaps you should lie back and enjoy the sunshine whilst the UK grafts to keep you in sunny Europe where you may enjoy your new found isolationism.
Again how is me thinking tying ourselves to trade deals with more vibrant economies across the globe rather than just dealing with our under performing neighbours isolationist?
I can assure you that I grafted to keep me in sunny Europe I am not relying on the U.K. to write me a cheque or to tell me how to run my business.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 6:29 pm

have the audacity to tell people like myself on how to prosper and get on with it.
Then don’t get on with it and wither and die. The world or the country doesn’t owe you a living.

I mean what are you expecting re trade deals?
Boris Johnson to call you up tomorrow.
“Waz, you’re right I’ve been neglecting your business with all this covid. I’ve booked you an appointment with a buyer in Singapore. I’ve booked your flight and got your suit dry cleaned......”

As for self centred it’s pretty clear that there a very few red lines that would make you not rejoin.
“No we won’t have to join the Euro that’s fear mongering. Well if we do so what, we’ll be back in the club!!!!”

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Re: The Brexit effect

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EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 6:37 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 6:01 pm

Upon your points. Your economics position is nonsense. If we stop making stuff and buy nothing then we are okay? In order to prosper and pay for things like the NHS, the military and indeed government. The UK must earn offshore dollars. The balance of payments and borrowings within the UK is frightening.
Either you listen and don’t hear or you just don’t listen.
Ok to export things you have to make things, yes?
Now at the moment we aren’t making too much are we?
So if we aren’t making much we can’t sell much can we?
Now as a country we import more than we export anyhow?
So if we don’t export say £1 billion but at the same time aren’t importing £1 billion then our balance of payments isn’t unduly effected is it?
So when I ask you what the imports from the EU are all I am asking is the other half of the sum.
As for us having to earn offshore dollars to pay for our NHS please explain how a balance of payments deficit pays for the NHS?
I can see how it pays for other countries Health Services but not ours

I think, essentially you are saying that the UK has no need for or to trade with the EU regardless that the Union is our biggest customer.
I cannot agree with you that we should forego and trade either export or Import as long as the UK economy can push on and prosper.
That is the whole UK economy and not selected winners. Any positive balance of payment allows the government to spend and invest.
The past weeks the UK has lost many billions, of £ in financial services, 10,000 jobs and the 68% drop in EU export cannot be put down to Covid.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 6:41 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 6:13 pm

perhaps you should lie back and enjoy the sunshine whilst the UK grafts to keep you in sunny Europe where you may enjoy your new found isolationism.
Again how is me thinking tying ourselves to trade deals with more vibrant economies across the globe rather than just dealing with our under performing neighbours isolationist?
I can assure you that I grafted to keep me in sunny Europe I am not relying on the U.K. to write me a cheque or to tell me how to run my business.
Yes I'm sure you grafted and deserve your offshore retreat in the Sun. Perhaps you should indeed therefore let the youngsters who are setting out in the world of co operation and unions to get on with it and succeed. Rather than restrict their freedoms and opportunities as you seem intent upon.
Me, I started off with nothing. I still have most of it left.

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Re: The Brexit effect

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waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 6:58 pm

I think, essentially you are saying that the UK has no need for or to trade with the EU regardless that the Union is our biggest customer.
I cannot agree with you that we should forego and trade either export or Import as long as the UK economy can push on and prosper.
That is the whole UK economy and not selected winners. Any positive balance of payment allows the government to spend and invest.
The past weeks the UK has lost many billions, of £ in financial services, 10,000 jobs and the 68% drop in EU export cannot be put down to Covid.
No not at all but you keep putting words in my mouth to make your monologue look like a debate.

Well let’s stop Brexit then no one can say you didn’t give it every chance

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Re: The Brexit effect

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 7:03 pm

Perhaps you should indeed therefore let the youngsters who are setting out in the world of co operation and unions to get on with it and succeed. Rather than restrict their freedoms and opportunities as you seem intent upon.
That’s why I voted to leave to enable them to thrive without being shackled to a decaying club.
Should they want to live, travel and work in Europe they will still be able to despite the nonsense you spout

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waz-24-7
Kibkommer
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Re: The Brexit effect

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  •   Message 200 of 346 in Discussion

Post by waz-24-7 »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 7:36 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 07 Feb 2021 7:03 pm

Perhaps you should indeed therefore let the youngsters who are setting out in the world of co operation and unions to get on with it and succeed. Rather than restrict their freedoms and opportunities as you seem intent upon.
That’s why I voted to leave to enable them to thrive without being shackled to a decaying club.
Should they want to live, travel and work in Europe they will still be able to despite the nonsense you spout
Hmm
The youngsters must compete with their European piers who have freedom of movement to work and live without hindrance ours do NOT.
You fail to see how competitive the modern world is and that being British is not a ticket to anywhere you like.
If you researched many younger Brexit forums you would detect the viewpoint that most youngsters feel let down.
I quote one message from 2016
"if you are a white, and old brexiteer"...Please die.

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