BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by Hedge-fund »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 12 Jun 2021 10:54 pm
Hedge-fund wrote:
Sat 12 Jun 2021 10:19 pm
jofra wrote:
Sat 12 Jun 2021 9:59 pm
Crossing point questions

- not personal OPINIONS about "Brexit"..... search and contribute to "Politics"....

Couldn't agree more but the same poster keeps knocking my country and worshipping the eu on this forum. As long as he is allowed to...then challenges have to be allowed.

If all brexit references are moved to the politics section I think that would be fair and welcomed. Any threads that the poster tries to move towards anti UK/Brexit and pro eu should be moved too.

A cancer on this forum.
knocking "your" country!! worshipping the EU?? hardly … simply supporting a peaceful and beneficial Union amongst friends and trading partners whilst maintaining and supporting my Country that happens to be yours also.

I detect your clear dislike of any debate that is against your somewhat blinkered view, your apparent dislike of anything EU is astounding given that you may have chosen to leave the UK for a "better " life.

Given the popularity of the debate. ( look at the views) It makes little sense to move the topic to the sidelines. Unless of course the matter is best swept under the carpet away from proper meaningful discussion.

The crossing of the green line is most certainly linked to the right of passage by UK citizens into the ROC. A very Brexit outcome.

UK citizens as non Europeans now have NO legal right of entry or transition through the ROC. The ROC will certainly capitalise on this in coming months and going forwards as a further opportunity to target and hinder the TRNC.
It is unlikely that visitors to the ROC only will be hindered. Only those UK aliens that are seen to be visiting and or supporting the TRNC.

That clearly answers , from a legal prospective, the initial post that seeks advice upon crossing the green line.

Essentially then. The ROC is within the EU. EU law prevails and this is the law that all must abide by. UK citizens are outside of the EU and therefore can be challenged and or refused entry as the ROC administration sees fit. The BRS or any UK official simply cannot advise or instruct you upon EU matters because they have NO jurisdiction or right. The risk is with you when you try to cross into or fly to the ROC.

We are out of the eu after a fair vote. As a nation are aware we are out of the eu. We are happy to be out of the eu.

Now that we are out of the eu, thankfully the rules of entry and exit have changed. We are aware of that and are happy with that.

Whatever rules a sovereign nation makes regarding our entry to its territory is its right and we deal with it - be it cyprus, usa, australia etc etc

What went before is history.

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Re: Crossing point questions

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Post by Hedge-fund »

Butterflyaway wrote:
Sun 13 Jun 2021 9:29 am
Apologies for returning to the subject heading, “Crossing Point Questions”

Prior to Br**it, many countries were classed by the ROC as third countries. USA, Russia and Israel to name but a few.

I understand that citizens of these countries were allowed to cross but were only allowed 90 days in 180 and staying in the North did not stop the “clock ticking”.

I also understand that they were allowed to use Ercan and still cross over. So they were not classed as arriving at an illegal port.

Now, UK citizens are being classed as third country nationals. So we should be treated the same as the Americans, etc? They, like everyone leaving the ROC heading North, never stopped at the ROC crossing point.

So, my question is why have the ROC crossing points (leaving to come North) had brand new kiosks installed that require people leaving the ROC side to stop and show their passports and negative PCR/Antigen tests? Is it just because of COVID? Why would they care if we are leaving?

Are they going to count a shopping day as one day out of 90 and allow us to keep spending in the South?

Good questions, and having spoken to people closer to the arena I understand negotiations for long term rules for Brits are ougoing between the governments.

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Re: Crossing point questions

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Post by Hedge-fund »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 12 Jun 2021 10:47 pm
Hedge-fund wrote:
Sat 12 Jun 2021 9:24 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sat 12 Jun 2021 8:23 pm


Thanks,
I've always been British and a UK citizen ; so no change there.

If I want to go to, trade with, or buy from the EU I must abide by their laws and bureaucracy. No change there either except that the privileges and advantages that I had , having an EU passport ,have been forfeited.

Hey. I guess you are right on the wonderful utopia that we now have here in UK tho.
I've seen nothing that makes me glad. Particularly regarding getting to my house in Cyprus that, as a non European, has become less accessible certainly.
I don't believe EU passports exist........yet.

Also I would advise anyone not happy living in the UK and yearning to live in the eu to kindly bugger off and live there.

OMG
that's a sensible notion indeed. I think not. Did that come from Mr Farage possibly?

Tell that to the Scottish that likely now want to leave the United Kingdom.
Tell that to the Northern Irish Unionists who are likely to pick up arms along with the republicans.

Yes that's a lovely mess that Brexit has launched!! Some saw this coming. Some did not. Some will just get on with it regardless.

I think you may have trouble with the concept of self-determination.

If a people vote for independence then the vote must be respected. Falklands & Gibraltar had referendums and the results were respected. The UK had a referendum and , after many attempts to overturn it, the result was respected.

If any country in the UK votes to leave then it is their right to leave.

It's called democracy and votes don't always go the way you want them to but you can either get on with it or remain angry bitter and twisted for the rest of your life.

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Re: Crossing point questions

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Post by DieHard »

Chriswright03 how true, most decent discussions go off the rails on this forum now.

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Re: Crossing point questions

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Post by Keithcaley »

DieHard wrote:
Sun 13 Jun 2021 1:26 pm
Chriswright03 how true, most decent discussions go off the rails on this forum now.

DieHard, I wouldn't dısagree, but experience has taught me that every thread on every Forum in the World eventually wanders 'Off Topic' - it seems to be some sort of Universal Constant ;)

Perhaps Crumpy can give us the Formula! :)

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Re: Crossing point questions

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Post by iancrumpy »

Keithcaley wrote:
Sun 13 Jun 2021 2:53 pm
Experience has taught me that every thread on every Forum in the World eventually wanders 'Off Topic' - it seems to be some sort of UniversalConstant ;) Perhaps Crumpy can give us the Formula! :)
And deriving any such a formula is sure to keep us better on the rails :) But yes, I agree that all threads of any length always stray at least a little from the subject of the thread. I'm also very aware that you and Soner are experts at introducing a little humour into threads when you sense things are getting a little heated. For this thread though I can fully understand why members would like to stay as much as possible on-topic. Thanks in particular to PingPong007 for relaying his recent experience at the Pyla crossing.

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Re: Crossing point questions

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Post by Chriswright03 »

I fully accept thread creep and in itself there is nothing wrong with that. Circular argument about Brexit by the same protagonists add nothing to the thread and I imagine stop many from even bothering opening it again to see if there is anything new and of interst in relation to the subject. That is where the problem lies. People intent on keeping an argument that will never be settled rolling when it has nothing to do with the subject.

Please, please, please can we stick to the subject and then just maybe we may see something that will help many on here?

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Re: Crossing point questions

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Post by waz-24-7 »

There still remains a lot of chitter chatter upon differing experiences and questions upon what a UK citizens can and cannot do.

It is essential, in my view that you look at the legal perspective upon UK citizen rights within the EU. (ROC being within the EU)

I have on many occasions drawn attention that the "Cyprus problem" present some unique risks upon a favoured entry to ROC and transition into the TRNC. That is the Republic of Cyprus ( they are NOT Greek please)
seeks to haste and hinder the TRNC and its supporters at any opportunity.

Legally UK citizens have surrendered the legal EU based right of entry to the ROC. The UK government may advise somewhat but that applies to the ROC ONLY. It will definitely not include persons wishing to travel across the green line into the North or occupied territory.
The UK now has even less influence on the "Cyprus problem" Its an EU problem and the UK is not even in the room but listening from ouside in the corridor. The recent petition to UK Government was just too late. ( after Brexit)

There lies the risk .. You Cannot legally fly to the ROC and travel across the Green line.
Some are certainly getting away with it and are lucky or are hoodwinking ROC authorities upon their intent. I think this could work in the shorter term but I expect the ROC to quite quickly capitalise on a clear opportunity to hinder and harm firstly non EU UK citizens but ultimately the TRNC will lose out.

Yes
We certainly raised the drawbridge and now we must live with it.
It is disappointing that some in this discussion insist on taking the "it was worth it" and " I love my Country" line of argument. it falls short on this particular issue we face. My views on our departure are well known and these views have not changed at all. Accessing Cyprus is just one of many issues thrust upon me .

Fact is if your in The TRNC either living , visiting or holidaying you have made life as a UK EX Pat more difficult and stressful as access is now more problematic and certainly more time and financially expensive.

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Re: Crossing point questions

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Post by Soner »

The RoC government is simply playing "silly buggers" at the moment. Why the UK continually support them and never the TRNC is beyond me. It was EOKA that wanted the British out in the first instance, and succeeded. Now UK is out of EU, RoC now have opportunities to do as they will. It is time the UK government opened their eyes.

In the grand scheme of things, it is "no big deal". People just want to know where they stand, nothing is completely clear at the moment. If people have to avoid the RoC to get to TRNC, then that is what they will do. I need to be in the RoC in Sept, so if I have to, I will fly out from Ercan to Turkey and fly into the RoC via another country. I didn't vote, but accept the outcome of Brexit. It's done.

When borders had opened on 4th June, GC's flooded into TRNC, Erulku was full of GC's doing their shopping, and then most probably filling up with fuel before their return. If RoC continues to hinder access, then TRNC can simply close its borders. I am pretty sure if that happened then many GC's would put pressure on their government to rectify situation.

There is no need for restrictions, especially UK expats living in TRNC, due to SBA between TRNC and RoC. Borders had been closed for over 40 years and everyone just got on with life. However, why go backwards when all went well with open borders, it was a win win for all concerned.

I believe it will all get sorted in due course. People just need clear information as to what they can do and not do. Penalising people for over 90 day stay by not exiting through RoC ports will only decrease revenue for the RoC, it will achieve nothing positive, and is causing unnecessary grief for some.

There are expats stuck in TRNC due to Covid; is it right that they should be fined for overstaying their 90 days due to flying in from RoC? These are more important issues that should be dealt with first.

For me, all I want is a Big Mac! That's all! Looking for loopholes in the current system to satisfy my needs. (8))
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Re: Crossing point questions

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Post by Hedge-fund »

:+1:)
Soner wrote:
Sun 13 Jun 2021 9:34 pm
The RoC government is simply playing "silly buggers" at the moment. Why the UK continually support them and never the TRNC is beyond me. It was EOKA that wanted the British out in the first instance, and succeeded. Now UK is out of EU, RoC now have opportunities to do as they will. It is time the UK government opened their eyes.

In the grand scheme of things, it is "no big deal". People just want to know where they stand, nothing is completely clear at the moment. If people have to avoid the RoC to get to TRNC, then that is what they will do. I need to be in the RoC in Sept, so if I have to, I will fly out from Ercan to Turkey and fly into the RoC via another country. I didn't vote, but accept the outcome of Brexit. It's done.

When borders had opened on 4th June, GC's flooded into TRNC, Erulku was full of GC's doing their shopping, and then most probably filling up with fuel before their return. If RoC continues to hinder access, then TRNC can simply close its borders. I am pretty sure if that happened then many GC's would put pressure on their government to rectify situation.

There is no need for restrictions, especially UK expats living in TRNC, due to SBA between TRNC and RoC. Borders had been closed for over 40 years and everyone just got on with life. However, why go backwards when all went well with open borders, it was a win win for all concerned.

I believe it will all get sorted in due course. People just need clear information as to what they can do and not do. Penalising people for over 90 day stay by not exiting through RoC ports will only decrease revenue for the RoC, it will achieve nothing positive, and is causing unnecessary grief for some.

There are expats stuck in TRNC due to Covid; is it right that they should be fined for overstaying their 90 days due to flying in from RoC? These are more important issues that should be dealt with first.

For me, all I want is a Big Mac! That's all! Looking for loopholes in the current system to satisfy my needs. (8))
Agree 100%

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Re: Crossing point questions

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Post by Hedge-fund »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 13 Jun 2021 7:57 pm
There still remains a lot of chitter chatter upon differing experiences and questions upon what a UK citizens can and cannot do.

It is essential, in my view that you look at the legal perspective upon UK citizen rights within the EU. (ROC being within the EU)

I have on many occasions drawn attention that the "Cyprus problem" present some unique risks upon a favoured entry to ROC and transition into the TRNC. That is the Republic of Cyprus ( they are NOT Greek please)
seeks to haste and hinder the TRNC and its supporters at any opportunity.

Legally UK citizens have surrendered the legal EU based right of entry to the ROC. The UK government may advise somewhat but that applies to the ROC ONLY. It will definitely not include persons wishing to travel across the green line into the North or occupied territory.
The UK now has even less influence on the "Cyprus problem" Its an EU problem and the UK is not even in the room but listening from ouside in the corridor. The recent petition to UK Government was just too late. ( after Brexit)

There lies the risk .. You Cannot legally fly to the ROC and travel across the Green line.
Some are certainly getting away with it and are lucky or are hoodwinking ROC authorities upon their intent. I think this could work in the shorter term but I expect the ROC to quite quickly capitalise on a clear opportunity to hinder and harm firstly non EU UK citizens but ultimately the TRNC will lose out.

Yes
We certainly raised the drawbridge and now we must live with it.
It is disappointing that some in this discussion insist on taking the "it was worth it" and " I love my Country" line of argument. it falls short on this particular issue we face. My views on our departure are well known and these views have not changed at all. Accessing Cyprus is just one of many issues thrust upon me .

Fact is if your in The TRNC either living , visiting or holidaying you have made life as a UK EX Pat more difficult and stressful as access is now more problematic and certainly more time and financially expensive.
And people wonder why I challenge this bilge.

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Re: Crossing point questions

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Post by jofra »

Why don't others?

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Re: Crossing point questions

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Post by waz-24-7 »

Hedge-fund wrote:
Sun 13 Jun 2021 9:59 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 13 Jun 2021 7:57 pm
There still remains a lot of chitter chatter upon differing experiences and questions upon what a UK citizens can and cannot do.

It is essential, in my view that you look at the legal perspective upon UK citizen rights within the EU. (ROC being within the EU)

I have on many occasions drawn attention that the "Cyprus problem" present some unique risks upon a favoured entry to ROC and transition into the TRNC. That is the Republic of Cyprus ( they are NOT Greek please)
seeks to haste and hinder the TRNC and its supporters at any opportunity.

Legally UK citizens have surrendered the legal EU based right of entry to the ROC. The UK government may advise somewhat but that applies to the ROC ONLY. It will definitely not include persons wishing to travel across the green line into the North or occupied territory.
The UK now has even less influence on the "Cyprus problem" Its an EU problem and the UK is not even in the room but listening from ouside in the corridor. The recent petition to UK Government was just too late. ( after Brexit)

There lies the risk .. You Cannot legally fly to the ROC and travel across the Green line.
Some are certainly getting away with it and are lucky or are hoodwinking ROC authorities upon their intent. I think this could work in the shorter term but I expect the ROC to quite quickly capitalise on a clear opportunity to hinder and harm firstly non EU UK citizens but ultimately the TRNC will lose out.

Yes
We certainly raised the drawbridge and now we must live with it.
It is disappointing that some in this discussion insist on taking the "it was worth it" and " I love my Country" line of argument. it falls short on this particular issue we face. My views on our departure are well known and these views have not changed at all. Accessing Cyprus is just one of many issues thrust upon me .

Fact is if your in The TRNC either living , visiting or holidaying you have made life as a UK EX Pat more difficult and stressful as access is now more problematic and certainly more time and financially expensive.
And people wonder why I challenge this bilge.
And I wonder why your input to the debate is so limited and without any helpful substance.

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Re: Crossing point questions

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Post by waz-24-7 »

Soner wrote:
Sun 13 Jun 2021 9:34 pm
The RoC government is simply playing "silly buggers" at the moment. Why the UK continually support them and never the TRNC is beyond me. It was EOKA that wanted the British out in the first instance, and succeeded. Now UK is out of EU, RoC now have opportunities to do as they will. It is time the UK government opened their eyes.

In the grand scheme of things, it is "no big deal". People just want to know where they stand, nothing is completely clear at the moment. If people have to avoid the RoC to get to TRNC, then that is what they will do. I need to be in the RoC in Sept, so if I have to, I will fly out from Ercan to Turkey and fly into the RoC via another country. I didn't vote, but accept the outcome of Brexit. It's done.

When borders had opened on 4th June, GC's flooded into TRNC, Erulku was full of GC's doing their shopping, and then most probably filling up with fuel before their return. If RoC continues to hinder access, then TRNC can simply close its borders. I am pretty sure if that happened then many GC's would put pressure on their government to rectify situation.

There is no need for restrictions, especially UK expats living in TRNC, due to SBA between TRNC and RoC. Borders had been closed for over 40 years and everyone just got on with life. However, why go backwards when all went well with open borders, it was a win win for all concerned.

I believe it will all get sorted in due course. People just need clear information as to what they can do and not do. Penalising people for over 90 day stay by not exiting through RoC ports will only decrease revenue for the RoC, it will achieve nothing positive, and is causing unnecessary grief for some.

There are expats stuck in TRNC due to Covid; is it right that they should be fined for overstaying their 90 days due to flying in from RoC? These are more important issues that should be dealt with first.

For me, all I want is a Big Mac! That's all! Looking for loopholes in the current system to satisfy my needs. (8))
Yes , substance in what you say.
That is reflective of UK citizens that are familiar with, residents of or frequent visitors to Cyprus and TRNC.

The issue I see is the ability going forward of the TRNC to win the very lucrative UK tourist revenue.
It has been difficult to say the least but I think some headway was being made even using Larnaca and Paphos as staging posts to visit the North.

This I believe is now under threat and the ROC "buggers" will try an put pay to the Northern opportunity to prosper.
I'm afraid it is the ROC that now carry the ace cards on the back of a weaker UK position within the EU.

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by Soner »

Topic has been split due to going off topic.
Continue here with Brexit effect on crossing points.
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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

“ Essentially then. The ROC is within the EU. EU law prevails and this is the law that all must abide by.”

That right Waz??

No spinning it into we can pick and choose, veto etc?

EU law prevails and if you are in the EU you have to follow laws that your legally elected government might have had little say in?

It’s taken 5 years and a lot of smoke and mirrors but we finally know why millions wanted out of the EU, thanks for finally clearing it up.

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by waz-24-7 »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Mon 14 Jun 2021 1:50 pm
“ Essentially then. The ROC is within the EU. EU law prevails and this is the law that all must abide by.”

That right Waz??

No spinning it into we can pick and choose, veto etc?

EU law prevails and if you are in the EU you have to follow laws that your legally elected government might have had little say in?

It’s taken 5 years and a lot of smoke and mirrors but we finally know why millions wanted out of the EU, thanks for finally clearing it up.
Yes of course,
Somewhat irrelevant to the topic.

One must question why you have left the UK and are indeed much closer to the EU than any normalised homelander.

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Mon 14 Jun 2021 6:06 pm

Yes of course,
Somewhat irrelevant to the topic.

One must question why you have left the UK and are indeed much closer to the EU than any normalised homelander.
One is very relevant as to why the majority voted to leave the EU and the other is irrelevant.
I voted to leave because ultimately I believed my children and grandchildren would be better off with the U.K. outside the EU.

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by waz-24-7 »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Mon 14 Jun 2021 6:17 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Mon 14 Jun 2021 6:06 pm

Yes of course,
Somewhat irrelevant to the topic.

One must question why you have left the UK and are indeed much closer to the EU than any normalised homelander.
One is very relevant as to why the majority voted to leave the EU and the other is irrelevant.
I voted to leave because ultimately I believed my children and grandchildren would be better off with the U.K. outside the EU.
Oh Dear
I wonder if the youngsters within your family take the same view, and if so why?
Certainly data shows that most young people relish the freedoms that unions bring forth.

Regardless the UK has been in and is now out. I hope the tides will again change and Europe will maintain a position of power amongst the big global players.

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Mon 14 Jun 2021 8:58 pm

I hope the tides will again change and Europe will maintain a position of power amongst the big global players.
I wish Europe well but my priority is the UK and Cyprus doing well

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Mon 14 Jun 2021 8:58 pm

Oh Dear
I wonder if the youngsters within your family take the same view, and if so why?
Certainly data shows that most young people relish the freedoms that unions bring forth.
Yes they are devastated that they now can’t go to countries in Europe. Oh wait....

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by waz-24-7 »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Mon 14 Jun 2021 9:41 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Mon 14 Jun 2021 8:58 pm

I hope the tides will again change and Europe will maintain a position of power amongst the big global players.
I wish Europe well but my priority is the UK and Cyprus doing well
Well given the UK is now somewhat marginalised from EU member that is Cyprus perhaps your thoughts were misguided.
I see a steady decline in UK investment within Cyprus particularly the North as routes and passages of entry become more challenging for holiday makers and visitors in general.

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 25 Jul 2021 12:52 pm

Well given the UK is now somewhat marginalised from EU member that is Cyprus perhaps your thoughts were misguided.
I see a steady decline in UK investment within Cyprus particularly the North as routes and passages of entry become more challenging for holiday makers and visitors in general.
Well fingers crossed the UK become so skint they couldn't invest anything anywhere eh?

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by waz-24-7 »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 25 Jul 2021 1:02 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 25 Jul 2021 12:52 pm

Well given the UK is now somewhat marginalised from EU member that is Cyprus perhaps your thoughts were misguided.
I see a steady decline in UK investment within Cyprus particularly the North as routes and passages of entry become more challenging for holiday makers and visitors in general.
Well fingers crossed the UK become so skint they couldn't invest anything anywhere eh?
I'm guessing your fingers crossed is somewhat misguided. Not mine certainly.
My viewpoint is based solely on fact and experience that I see back here in the UK.
Yours appears to be that of an ex pat meddling in matters that you have clearly left behind in your distant homeland. A homeland you have chosen to leave for a "better sunny life". A life becoming more isolated from UK citizens who now find it more difficult to travel within the EU including Cyprus., Costs associated with restricted access and routes to TRNC will of course reduce UK citizen traffic and investment.

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by Groucho »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 25 Jul 2021 11:23 pm
EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 25 Jul 2021 1:02 pm
waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 25 Jul 2021 12:52 pm

Well given the UK is now somewhat marginalised from EU member that is Cyprus perhaps your thoughts were misguided.
I see a steady decline in UK investment within Cyprus particularly the North as routes and passages of entry become more challenging for holiday makers and visitors in general.
Well fingers crossed the UK become so skint they couldn't invest anything anywhere eh?
I'm guessing your fingers crossed is somewhat misguided. Not mine certainly.
My viewpoint is based solely on fact and experience that I see back here in the UK.
Yours appears to be that of an ex pat meddling in matters that you have clearly left behind in your distant homeland. A homeland you have chosen to leave for a "better sunny life". A life becoming more isolated from UK citizens who now find it more difficult to travel within the EU including Cyprus., Costs associated with restricted access and routes to TRNC will of course reduce UK citizen traffic and investment.
Northern Cyprus doesn't need more investment in buildings - it needs to rein in the unfettered development of housing. hotels and casinos.... UK Ex-pat investment also does nothing for the environment other than destroy it. There needs to be investment in infrastructure, water, sewage treatment, solar power and wind farms... none of that is piece-meal investment.

A nuclear plant in Turkey to provide power for the TRNC is a mad-cap scheme knowing what we now know about how much these schemes turn out cost to run and to decommission. The case for fossil fuel and nuclear power is no longer tenable, they simply have no place in the world as we know it now. If solar and wind farms can be profitable in the UK, imagine how much power could be harvested here and wonder why old technology is still being touted as solutions to the ever increasing demand for power.

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

waz-24-7 wrote:
Sun 25 Jul 2021 11:23 pm

A life becoming more isolated from UK citizens who now find it more difficult to travel within the EU including Cyprus., Costs associated with restricted access and routes to TRNC will of course reduce UK citizen traffic and investment.
Errrrr Covid?

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

Groucho wrote:
Mon 26 Jul 2021 5:24 am

The case for fossil fuel and nuclear power is no longer tenable, they simply have no place in the world as we know it now.
Why?

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by Groucho »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Mon 26 Jul 2021 7:47 am
Groucho wrote:
Mon 26 Jul 2021 5:24 am

The case for fossil fuel and nuclear power is no longer tenable, they simply have no place in the world as we know it now.
Why?
Generating power from fossil fuels is both dirty and polluting. Costly in human health and ecological terms. Pneumoconiosis, byssinosis CO2 emissions, Carbon monoxide... etc

Nuclear power once touted as 'free energy' has been very adequately demonstrated by the various nuclear disasters during our lifetimes to be a ticking bomb, then there's the disposal and storage of spent fuel, the proliferation of fissionable by-products (nuclear material proliferation and the danger they represent) and the decommissioning costs render the cost benefit business case unfit for purpose.

The case for green energy where implementation costs are tumbling is becoming evermore competitive with the traditional means of power generation and fossil and nuclear costs have been proved to undercut by green alternatives as an ongoing supply.

In Cyprus, blessed as it is with as much sunshine as it is, there can be no economic case made for more fossil fuel or a nuclear power plant to be constructed to supply power via underwater cables... frankly the mind boggles at the potential for disaster...

Of course this highly politically charged umbilical cord would link Turkey and the TRNC in much the same way as the water pipe, the economic for which is very different... we are all benefitting from that but that does not persuade me that nuclear power is the way forward.

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Mon 26 Jul 2021 1:47 pm
Groucho wrote:
Mon 26 Jul 2021 12:49 pm


The case for green energy where implementation costs are tumbling
Ok so how much will it cost to make the UK carbon neutral? The figure I’ve heard touted is one trillion pounds, that accurate?
If so where’s it coming from?

Couple more questions;

Ok carbon causes climate change. Think we all agree on that?

Now I understand the science is settled so by that I assume the figures have been modelled and verified because that is to my understanding is how you settle the science?

CO2 accounts for 0.04% of our atmosphere correct?

And of this 0.04%, 95 percent come from natural sources, correct?

This 95% we can do nothing about, correct?

So human CO2 content in the atmosphere or man made is only 0.0016%, correct?

I note that the U.K. is responsible of 1% of that man made 0.0016% so the U.K. is responsible for 0.000016%, correct?

So as the science is settled can you tell me what would be the effect of say a 20% increase and 20% decrease in man made CO2?

For example the science is settled on the boiling of liquids. Someone could tell you how quick water would boil at different temperatures so if you put the temperature up 20% they would be able to tell you how long that pan of water would now take to boil, correct?

Are all the effects negative and none positive? For example if the planet warmed by half a degree might we get more of certain crops? If the planet cooled by half a degree might some diseases become less prevalent?

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by Groucho »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Mon 26 Jul 2021 1:51 pm
EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Mon 26 Jul 2021 1:47 pm
Groucho wrote:
Mon 26 Jul 2021 12:49 pm


The case for green energy where implementation costs are tumbling
Ok so how much will it cost to make the UK carbon neutral? The figure I’ve heard touted is one trillion pounds, that accurate?
If so where’s it coming from?

Couple more questions;

Ok carbon causes climate change. Think we all agree on that?

Now I understand the science is settled so by that I assume the figures have been modelled and verified because that is to my understanding is how you settle the science?

CO2 accounts for 0.04% of our atmosphere correct?

And of this 0.04%, 95 percent come from natural sources, correct?

This 95% we can do nothing about, correct?

So human CO2 content in the atmosphere or man made is only 0.0016%, correct?

I note that the U.K. is responsible of 1% of that man made 0.0016% so the U.K. is responsible for 0.000016%, correct?

So as the science is settled can you tell me what would be the effect of say a 20% increase and 20% decrease in man made CO2?

For example the science is settled on the boiling of liquids. Someone could tell you how quick water would boil at different temperatures so if you put the temperature up 20% they would be able to tell you how long that pan of water would now take to boil, correct?

Are all the effects negative and none positive? For example if the planet warmed by half a degree might we get more of certain crops? If the planet cooled by half a degree might some diseases become less prevalent?
What you really need to ask is, 'whats the cost of keeping fossil fuel power and nuclear in the TRNC' my points are to do with here and the power generation road map currently being trod... I'm sure some of the logic could be applied to any economy looking at their future power requirements but this thread is not about the UK investments is it, somebody raised spectre of TRNC attracting inward investment, I'm merely pointing out that some inward investment has negative environmental impact and where the more important investment decisions ought to focus - here.

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

Groucho wrote:
Mon 26 Jul 2021 12:49 pm

fossil and nuclear costs have been proved to undercut by green alternatives as an ongoing supply.
So in the U.K. there are no government subsidies for green alternatives?

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

Groucho wrote:
Mon 26 Jul 2021 5:24 am

UK Ex-pat investment also does nothing for the environment other than destroy it.
As in buying a home here?

I don’t think most people think when buying a home “hey it would be great if they built another 20 homes around me that they won’t sell.”

If people for various reasons decide to massively over supply to fill a demand that is hardly the fault of U.K. ex pats is it?

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by waz-24-7 »

The debate has come rather disjointed.
Investment in any economy is the drive for improvement and betterment. It win votes too!.

Regarding the environment and particularly energy production. Of course there is a very good case for a carbon neutral habitation of planet earth.
Longevity of the planet is correctly in real focus.
I'm afraid its all rather too late to prolong the human race beyond possibly another 6-7 generations. By this point the human race will have become extra terrestrial, intergalactic OR may become extinct. Recent space flights signal the future for mankind. Depart this planet or die.

On the topic,
Ex pat investment in TRNC will hardly destroy the environment. Its a small fish in a much bigger ocean. Investment will possibly come from other Europeans and non Europeans who will be attracted by freedoms and privileges that are awarded to them by visiting Cyprus generally.

On another note. I am saddened today to see this week a Cargo ship departing Preveza in Greece. The said shipment is stacked full of UK registered VAT paid yachts that are now Brexit forced to get back into UK waters or face European VAT charges. Another absolute negative for leaving the EU. The UK yachtie community has lost the decades of glorious Mediterranean cruising privileges. Great take control move that is Mr Farage and Cummings. Small loss many will say. Its still a loss and it makes me sad for those cruising UK Citizens thrust into turmoil and strife as they are rejected from many ports of call.

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by Groucho »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Mon 26 Jul 2021 6:06 pm
Groucho wrote:
Mon 26 Jul 2021 5:24 am

UK Ex-pat investment also does nothing for the environment other than destroy it.
As in buying a home here?

I don’t think most people think when buying a home “hey it would be great if they built another 20 homes around me that they won’t sell.”

If people for various reasons decide to massively over supply to fill a demand that is hardly the fault of U.K. ex pats is it?
I never said it was the fault of any immigrants from anywhere - UK or otherwise, it's construction that has no effective control mechanisms in place, no consideration of the environmental impact that sees thousands of new builds next to abandoned half-built projects, with no plan for the necessary infrastructure to support the demand for services including education and jobs.

It's hopelessly inadequate building regulations that allow poorly insulated, damp-prone concrete boxes with poor ground water insulation to be built. Mostly for a market that prices-out locals with low incomes creating enclaves of incomers. No social housing plans and no adherence to best practices.

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by kibsolar1999 »

[/quote]

And of this 0.04%, 95 percent come from natural sources, correct?

This 95% we can do nothing about, correct?

So human CO2 content in the atmosphere or man made is only 0.0016%, correct?

I note that the U.K. is responsible of 1% of that man made 0.0016% so the U.K. is responsible for 0.000016%, correct?

[/quote]

your numbers are wrong.
https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautifu ... over_last/

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Re: BREXIT from: Crossing point questions

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

kibsolar1999 wrote:
Thu 05 Aug 2021 5:35 pm
And of this 0.04%, 95 percent come from natural sources, correct?

This 95% we can do nothing about, correct?

So human CO2 content in the atmosphere or man made is only 0.0016%, correct?

I note that the U.K. is responsible of 1% of that man made 0.0016% so the U.K. is responsible for 0.000016%, correct?

[/quote]

your numbers are wrong.
https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautifu ... over_last/
[/quote]

Ok as debunked by this graph you supplied?
graph.jpeg
Looks like 0.04% to me?
percent.jpeg
percent.jpeg (9.17 KiB) Viewed 7270 times
Sorry was I not meant to actually look at your gotcha graph and just be impressed by the lines?
I know it worked for the hockey stick but.....
How much as a % of the 400ppm are humans responsible for?

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