Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Brinsley
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Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by Brinsley »

Are solicitors/barristers/advocates exempt of restriction laws which I understand to be, NO unnecessary social or family visits unless in emergencies? The penthouse owner above my flat, has had her son (a very high ranking member of the Girne Bar Council) visit with his wife and child on a number of occasions over the last 5/6 weeks lock-down, the last time, this evening, leaving with no mask or gloves for him nor any of his family but plenty of time to drive wherever he may live before curfew!
I give up; One rule for most but the privileged, influential few do whatever with impunity, surely knowing what guidelines/rules are!

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Re: Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by frontalman »

Didn't you know it only affects other people?

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Re: Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by 13roman58 »

All pigs are equal but some pigs are more equal than others.

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Re: Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by MnM »

There was almost normal traffic on the roads yesterday in the UK, or at least in my area. Following the government exit measures meeting the day before, I think everyone took that meeting as meaning the lockdown has ended here and now.

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Re: Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by sophie »

Brinsley, surely you knew that???? Same profession in our road, mixture of BMW, Merc, Audi and one Jag. Having a great time yesterday when I passed. The food smelled wonderful, if I hadn't the dog with me I'd have asked if I could join in.

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Re: Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by Saintsfan »

MnM wrote:
Sat 02 May 2020 8:28 am
There was almost normal traffic on the roads yesterday in the UK, or at least in my area. Following the government exit measures meeting the day before, I think everyone took that meeting as meaning the lockdown has ended here and now.
Same here in our small village on our walk yesterday 16 cars passed us in 3 minutes and we only walk on a small stretch of pavement along a main road, this was about 10.30 am when most people working are not travelling then.

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Re: Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by jofra »

The eternal disregard and ignoring of rules, laws and restrictions by those of certain 'social' status and/or in certain professions occurs in every country, every society around the world - it always has and always will; it is merely more obvious and blatant in some countries than others. It will never change, because even you, I, and EVERYONE will at some time think "Oh, well, just this once....." - because it's just a TINY little thing that doesn't really count....

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Re: Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by Brinsley »

Not wishing to open a new topic heading I'm continuing on with this one!
Saturday 16th May, 3.19am I went to my balcony to cool off and saw two African students wandering down the middle of the road entering their University accommodation bloc nearly opposite mine without a care in the world!!? I nearly screamed at them about curfew but thought better of it not wishing to wake neighbours who were sleeping. Unbelievable, but should I report to the Police, however, too dark to identify and the bloc has 14+ flats to pinpoint the culprits?

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Re: Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by sophie »

Brinsley, same sort of thing re students has been happening weekend after weekend close to our place. Like the privileged few, students also appear to be immune. They have totally ignored lockdown from the get go. Haven't a care in the world.

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Re: Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

Brinsley wrote:
Sat 16 May 2020 5:51 pm
Saturday 16th May, 3.19am I went to my balcony to cool off and saw two African students wandering down the middle of the road entering their University accommodation bloc nearly opposite mine without a care in the world!!? I nearly screamed at them about curfew but thought better of it not wishing to wake neighbours who were sleeping. Unbelievable, but should I report to the Police, however, too dark to identify and the bloc has 14+ flats to pinpoint the culprits?
The virus does seem to have effected BAME people more, if we exclude that the disease is racist you have to question why. Is it that there is an underlying reason BAME people are more susceptible to it or is it that they are less likely to follow social distancing etc?
I do think that if you encourage a culture of you don't need to take notice of that you have enough to worry about you poor little poppitt then you might be setting them up for a fall somewhat.

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Re: Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by erol »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 17 May 2020 10:06 am
Brinsley wrote:
Sat 16 May 2020 5:51 pm
Saturday 16th May, 3.19am I went to my balcony to cool off and saw two African students wandering down the middle of the road entering their University accommodation bloc nearly opposite mine without a care in the world!!? I nearly screamed at them about curfew but thought better of it not wishing to wake neighbours who were sleeping. Unbelievable, but should I report to the Police, however, too dark to identify and the bloc has 14+ flats to pinpoint the culprits?
The virus does seem to have effected BAME people more, if we exclude that the disease is racist you have to question why. Is it that there is an underlying reason BAME people are more susceptible to it or is it that they are less likely to follow social distancing etc?
I do think that if you encourage a culture of you don't need to take notice of that you have enough to worry about you poor little poppitt then you might be setting them up for a fall somewhat.
Yet one more thing we do not know with certainty yet. There may be genetic factors. There may be soci- economic factors, related to poverty and related to how some groups have higher representations in certain jobs that may have higher risk profiles. It may be down to cultural factors,like
the degree and frequency which different groups 'socially distance' by default any way. Some or all of these may be the drivers behind the numbers we see.

As far as groups that we know have and do systematically ignore social distancing advise post covid-19, religious based groups are one of the most visible. The more 'extreme' the religious group the more we see it. One such example of that category would be ultra orthodox Jewish communities in places like New York and Israel. But maybe we should not mention this specific group though because of the holocaust ?

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Re: Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

Your 100% right Erol UK, USA and I forgot Israel (forgive me) bad everywhere else good.

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Post by erol »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 17 May 2020 4:33 pm
Your 100% right Erol UK, USA and I forgot Israel (forgive me) bad everywhere else good.
That is your prejudice not mine. I seek to properly understand what the commonality is that I am seeking to understand and criticise. Seeing a 'trait' in one group of people and then concluding the trait is the effect caused by someone being in the group is as common and as old as the hills as it is flawed. Work out what the commonality is and blame the commonality, not select given groups that displays it whilst at same time ignoring the same commonality in other groups also display it.

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Re: Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

Your 100% right Erol the virus is racist fingers crossed it doesn’t mutate into gender stereotyping

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Post by erol »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Mon 18 May 2020 5:53 am
Your 100% right Erol the virus is racist fingers crossed it doesn’t mutate into gender stereotyping
EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Sun 17 May 2020 10:06 am
The virus does seem to have effected BAME people more, if we exclude that the disease is racist you have to question why. Is it that there is an underlying reason BAME people are more susceptible to it or is it that they are less likely to follow social distancing etc?I do think that if you encourage a culture of you don't need to take notice of that you have enough to worry about you poor little poppitt then you might be setting them up for a fall somewhat.
I would just like you to be consistent is all. Are ultra Orthodox 'less likely to follow social distancing etc' ? Do you think if "you encourage a culture of you don't need to take notice of that you have enough to worry about you poor little poppitt then you might be setting them up for a fall somewhat" ?

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

erol wrote:
Mon 18 May 2020 7:26 am

I would just like you to be consistent is all. Are ultra Orthodox 'less likely to follow social distancing etc' ? Do you think if "you encourage a culture of you don't need to take notice of that you have enough to worry about you poor little poppitt then you might be setting them up for a fall somewhat" ?
1) To my knowledge Orthodox Jews haven’t been unduly affected by the virus

2) There are about 250,000 Jews in total in the UK As opposed to ten times that of say Muslims

3) The police do seem to tip toe around enforcing rules at Mosques than say a synagogue or church

But keep going with the false equivalences but don’t whine when the numbers rack up

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Post by erol »

I have not seen any evidence that BAME communities are ignoring social distancing any more or less than the general UK population. Yet you seem convinced that this is why they are showing disproportionate levels of shortened lifespans in the numbers we have so far.

I have seen evidence that extreme religious groups are consistently ignoring social distancing considerably more than the general population. Extreme Christian groups and extreme Jewish groups like the ultra Orthodox and no doubt extreme Muslim groups as well. I would therefore be extremely surprised if these groups did not end up showing higher % of infection and shortened lifespans as a result.

Imo as far as there is 'tip toeing' around issues of religion, race and ethnicity in the UK there is as much done re the Jewish community as there is re the Muslim community. It's an opinion. It's mine. I think the problem is the 'tip toeing' regardless of anything else. My perception of your position is that the problem of tip toeing only applies when done to some minority groups but is not a problem when done to others. I do not think such a woolly inconsistent approach helps in trying to address the problem, the actual problem.

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

Obviously we can’t speculate on cultural factors like a prevalence to marry your first cousin isn’t a good idea to be genetically tip top as shown by the Royals through history because that would be waaaycist. Personally if social distancing is the problem it might be an idea if the police thought avoiding being ultra pc and pointing out the error of their ways might be a thought but let’s avoid that hand grenade and let them crack on as letting them die in higher numbers isn’t in the slightest bit racist. Yep the virus is racist

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Post by erol »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Mon 18 May 2020 6:00 pm
Obviously we can’t speculate on cultural factors like a prevalence to marry your first cousin isn’t a good idea to be genetically tip top as shown by the Royals through history because that would be waaaycist. Personally if social distancing is the problem it might be an idea if the police thought avoiding being ultra pc and pointing out the error of their ways might be a thought but let’s avoid that hand grenade and let them crack on as letting them die in higher numbers isn’t in the slightest bit racist. Yep the virus is racist
I agree that if there is to be enforcement it should be applied equally to all groups regardless. Like in cases like this

https://metro.co.uk/2020/05/13/hundreds ... -12696187/

Of course there could be no chance that 'cultural or religious sensitivities' has any influence on how 'softly softly' the police might react to things like this. Because they would never have to fear accusations of antisemitism being levelled against them if they took a hard line would they ? So what is the prevalence of marrying first cousins within the ultra Orthodox Jewish community anyway then ETS ?

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

That was a one day celebration for a tiny minority who doesn’t seem to have died in any large numbers but your right Erol as unusual and the UK has millions of spare Muslims so let’s be pc and let them die in droves. Let’s not worry about how many black kids are dying from knife attacks. And we need to ignore vulnerable underage girls being raped in certain areas for the good of diversity. Can I be a woke bloke in a binary way too?????

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/n ... 442010.stm

It’s all about the numbers except when it isn’t.

So I guess it could be that BAME people are catching covid-19 in disproportionate numbers because

1) BAME people are not taking the measures to avoid catching the virus as well as others? No can’t have that because that is criticism.

2) BAME people have something in their make up that makes them particularly vulnerable to the virus more than others? No can’t have that because that is pointing out that there may be some inherent differences between races. Black people aren’t particularly gifted at running, Chinese people aren’t any better at maths than the rest of us. We are all the same you fascist.

3) Maybe something in the culture has led to this problem. Marrying first cousins means you have weakened yourself to catching stuff. No it doesn’t happen and it doesn’t apply although if you use it to criticise the Royals we’ll keep that part in.

4) The virus is racist. It’s all about the science errr well what about Jimmy Saville????

Cue a long rambling post that will totally avoid any of the above.

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Post by erol »

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Tue 19 May 2020 10:14 am
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/n ... 442010.stm

It’s all about the numbers except when it isn’t.
You jump all over the places. I have no issue with discussing how some ethnic minorities have higher incidents of generic disorders because of higher chances of inter marriage. if that is what the numbers show then we should discuss it and the solutions are pretty simple. Testing before marriage. As is done in places like France. Nor apparently does the BBC have any issue talking about such things because you showed them doing it. This is just total straw man argument.
EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Tue 19 May 2020 10:14 am
So I guess it could be that BAME people are catching covid-19 in disproportionate numbers because

1) BAME people are not taking the measures to avoid catching the virus as well as others? No can’t have that because that is criticism.
That could be a reason but you have yet to show any evidence that they behave in such ways. You are working backwards to suggest they are. You are working backwards with this group when there is evidence working forwards of religious groups that ARE ignoring social distancing and you seem to ignore that. So to use your rhetoric, do not come crying to me when they start showing signs of greater reduced lifespans.
EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Tue 19 May 2020 10:14 am
2) BAME people have something in their make up that makes them particularly vulnerable to the virus more than others? No can’t have that because that is pointing out that there may be some inherent differences between races. Black people aren’t particularly gifted at running, Chinese people aren’t any better at maths than the rest of us. We are all the same you fascist.
That also may be a reason. It is known that some conditions affect some ethnic groups more than others. It can be a genetic thing. No one is saying 'no we casn say that'. You are just making out that people are saying it to fit you narrative. I am not saying this. No one is saying this. Sickle cell affects different ethnic groups differently, at a genetic level. No one denies this.
EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Tue 19 May 2020 10:14 am
3) Maybe something in the culture has led to this problem. Marrying first cousins means you have weakened yourself to catching stuff. No it doesn’t happen and it doesn’t apply although if you use it to criticise the Royals we’ll keep that part in.
This may also be a cause. Who is denying this as a possibility ?
EnjoyingTheSun wrote:
Tue 19 May 2020 10:14 am
Cue a long rambling post that will totally avoid any of the above.
All of the above are possible causes that could explain the numbers seen. Some however are possible causes that I have not seen any evidence for yet, like BAME communities are systematically ignoring social distancing more than non BAME groups. What there IS evidence for is that BAME communities have a higher representation in higher risk professions. This is known yet not ONCE do you mention or acknowledged that THIS might explain why they are seeing higher rates of shortened lifespans from the virus. Happy to speculate that they do not social distance as much as non BAME groups. Happy to speculate that because they marry first cousins more than non BAME groups this means they suffer more from this specific virus. Seem to totally ignore that they work in higher risk jobs more than on BAME groups as a possible cause. What am I supposed to think is going on when I see that from ETS ? What I think is you do not care what the reasons actually are just how you can use the situation to keep banging on about your pet 'rants' that everyone is too over sensitive about issue to do with BAME groups (but not Jewish groups).

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Re: Advocates Exempt of Restrictions?

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Post by EnjoyingTheSun »

14% of the population are BAME 20% of the NHS workforce are BAME. Those numbers don’t explain the amount of cases. I don’t know what the figures are for supermarkets and they probably don’t have £100k diversity directors counting them unfortunately but I doubt they are that out of whack.

To my knowledge I haven’t seen Orthodox Jews complain about being picked on by covid-19 or being highlighted as a high at risk group. Also as it is such a tiny minority the chances or them spreading the virus to the general population is minuscule so it is pretty irrelevant. Want to bring up Jimmy Saville now?

Listen if you want to put 14% of our population at risk on the altar of political correctness carry on

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Post by Brinsley »

I am totally mystified why the simple observation of a member of the 'legal elite' defied legal restrictions of 'lock-down', later seeing others ignoring the curfew, that has now turned into a racist debate?! There is no excuse for ignorance, no matter where on Earth with whatever ethnic/colour/religious origins, individuals come from. However, I do make allowances for those that have just arrived from Mars and Uranus!!

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