Political Posts' Disappearing

[Brinsley]

Every time I post anything of suspicious corruption or question the moral integrity of the TRNC ruling class my writings quickly disappear! Why?!
I feel a Hong Kong, Belarus, dictatorship happening on this forum!
Bet this topic will be be quickly taken down!

[Proudsprey]

It's still here...

[jofra]

This thread regarding a new law may give a clue - if you say something that is "unacceptable", I would suggest that not only you but any and all who allow/publish your remarks would be held responsible and subsequently penalised - we do not want to lose this forum! I believe that similarly you should have no reason to criticise the banking system or banks in the TRNC...

[Hedge-fund]

This thread regarding a new law may give a clue - if you say something that is "unacceptable", I would suggest that not only you but any and all who allow/publish your remarks would be held responsible and subsequently penalised - we do not want to lose this forum! I believe that similarly you should have no reason to criticise the banking system or banks in the TRNC...

In that case.

Do not, under any circumstances, be afraid to have any money in a turkish bank.

They are all safe. And the lira is the strongest currency in the world......ever.

[Chriswright03]

Much is spoken about 'free speech' on the internet. Thing is it doesn't exist and one reason is as quoted by Jofra. One of the other reasons is that the owners of forums and Facebook groups are liable for prosecution if content breaks existing laws. Having an opinion is fine but expressing it when it may be libellous or detrimental to others leaves said owners in a difficult position.

[Keithcaley]

I think that the issue is explained by the following excerpts from the forum rules, remember that posting on a forum is not the same as shooting off your mouth in a bar - -


Be Polite Rudeness will not be tolerated. You may challenge others' points of view and
opinions, but do so respectfully and thoughtfully without insult and personal attack. Any
member being intentionally unpleasant or disruptive will be banned without warning.

Freedom of Speech We respect every member's right to post their opinions on all
issues providing they do not cause legal issues with regards to on-going court cases and
government laws, Worldwide.

Defamatory, Wrong or Misleading Posts By joining The Kibkom Forum, you agree
not to post any defamatory, wrong or misleading information about any person or any
company. Members doing so may be subject to legal action taken up against them. Your
post, member details and your IP address along with the time of your postings will be
used as evidence.

[Chriswright03]

I didn't realise the last bit was so important as to be repeated Keith.

[Soner]

Be Polite Rudeness will not be tolerated. You may challenge others' points of view and
opinions, but do so respectfully and thoughtfully without insult and personal attack. Any
member being intentionally unpleasant or disruptive will be banned without warning.

Freedom of Speech We respect every member's right to post their opinions on all
issues providing they do not cause legal issues with regards to on-going court cases and
government laws, Worldwide.

Defamatory, Wrong or Misleading Posts By joining The Kibkom Forum, you agree
not to post any defamatory, wrong or misleading information about any person or any
company. Members doing so may be subject to legal action taken up against them. Your
post, member details and your IP address along with the time of your postings will be
used as evidence.

[tutor4u]

I didn't realise the last bit was so important as to be repeated Keith.

Its Probably an Echo

[Keithcaley]

I didn't realise the last bit was so important as to be repeated Keith.

Thank you once again!

I had a little difficulty with copy-and-paste on my 'phone there...

[Wight]

So, if someone hacks your account and puts a defamatory post on here you could be up the creek without a paddle

[Keithcaley]

So, if someone hacks your account and puts a defamatory post on here...

... Or on facebook, or on the millions of internet forums and bulletin boards accessible from all over the world as well as from TRNC.

Scary!

[Wight]

Does make you wonder
Somehow though it feels a bit more perilous on here (not sure if that's the right words) because it's a country oriented site and it's a relatively small country ?

[Brinsley]

This thread regarding a new law may give a clue - if you say something that is "unacceptable", I would suggest that not only you but any and all who allow/publish your remarks would be held responsible and subsequently penalised - we do not want to lose this forum! I believe that similarly you should have no reason to criticise the banking system or banks in the TRNC...

I've allows maintained that if the American Government could find a way of taxing air, they would!
The Girne Belediyesi seem to have found a way by firing down pressurised air instead of water which turns the meter which you pay for, for nothing except air!!

That was the post that was taken down on another thread, maintaining that it was crooked, corrupt and fraudulent practice by the Government!

[Soner]

Not quite what you posted precviously Brinsley. But what are you trying to say? That the TRNC Government are delibarately fitting water meters that charge customers for air?

[Up the Reds.]

This subject seems to be the 'elephant in the cupboard'...The western world is being completely stifled of free speach. It is obvious that the political classes have found a way to stop us all speaking the truth and makes their ability to do just what they want so much easier. I have enjoyed reading this board for for many years before joining it recently but it is now obvious that only 'pink spectical' subjects are now OK!! I've spent most of my life here since 1979 and however hard the 'swallows' and 'newbies' try to do a sales job on the TRNC the facts remain Wights list were about right !! Endless excuses for the problems are given and sorry that changes nothing, it only makes those people look patronising to the rest of us. I can understand why Soner doesn't want to break the law but 'truth' should prevail whatever and everyone has an opinion equal to anybody elses ..not always accepted however.

[Proudsprey]

Freedom of speech is just that - the freedom to express an opinion - whether it is positive or a criticism. It is not however, the freedom to hurl unfounded accusations or untruths about any individual or organisation. It is all too easy to sit behind a screen wherever you are in the world and rap off a few lines without fear of being punched in the kisser like you would in the bar and said the same thing.
But - and this is the killer - freedom of speech, expressing an opinion is not difficult - just make sure that is the truth and can be evidenced. There are too many misleading, false or just downright abusive and hurtful comments on all forms of social media around the world at the moment and maybe, the new law introduced here IS a step in the right direction. What is wrong with filling the ethernet with positive and loving comments rather than wholly negative or untrue ones?
I will always, wherever I am, reserve the right to criticise anyone or anything if they deserve it but, before I do so I will make sure that it is a) truthful and b) backed up by evidence or fact.
But I also reserve the right to openly praise people an organisations in the same respect.
As people who know me will attest, I spent most of my day taking the mick - and that's fine as long as it is written or said without ambiguity that it is just that - taking the mick. Don't forget that the British humour of satire and irony is often lost on the rest of the world - it's often lost on a proportion of Brits!
Just try to be nice...and if you can't be nice, be factual

[Keithcaley]

Proudsprey, if you don't watch it, Soner may offer you a job as a moderator!

I'd like to look at Brinsley's complaint about 'air operating the water meters' - and consumers being charged for that air at the same rate as they are charged for water.

This is a phenomenon that is well known in TRNC - it used to be much more prevalent in the days when the water distribution network 'leaked like a sieve', because the local Belediyeler were inclined to turn off the supply for 4 days out of 5, thus reducing the amount of water lost by 80%.

It has reappeared recently due to damage to the supply lines, and also the acute water shortage - these factors have forced the local authorities to reduce water useage by cutting off the supply.

When the supply is cut off, all of the water drains out of the distribution pipes as people squeeze the last drops of water into their tanks.

The problem occurs when the water is turned back on - you have a 'wall of water' proceeding through miles and miles of empty pipework (empty except for air ) pushing air ahead of itself, which then escapes through any orifice that it can - and if that happens to be a consumer's tap or ball valve, turning over the consumer's meter in the process

Back in the days of regular water cuts, people knew to turn off their stopcocks at the meter until the supply network was full of water again, and all of the air had escaped through the leaks, but nowadays the distribution network has been largely replaced, there aren't as many leaks for the air to escape through, and also people no longer follow this practice.

The supply people are aware of the issue, and there are certain technical measures that can be applied at various points - including at consumer's meters - but they are expensive, and not 100% effective, and, you do have to complain 'until you're blue in the face' to get any sort of a fix!

So, it's an unfortunate side effect of livlng on an island with a somewhat limited water supply, and limited resources and money to put it right - not a deliberate attempt to rob you!

Just my opinion, of course!

[erol]

This is a phenomenon that is well known in TRNC -

The supply people are aware of the issue, and there are certain technical measures that can be applied at various points - including at consumer's meters - but they are expensive, and not 100% effective, and, you do have to complain 'until you're blue in the face' to get any sort of a fix!

So, it's an unfortunate side effect of livlng on an island with a somewhat limited water supply, and limited resources and money to put it right - not a deliberate attempt to rob you!

Just my opinion, of course!

this should probably be in a different thread but

been there done that



and



the cause of these issues was not created with intent to rob but the barriers put in place to stop you being able to get any sort of rebate against such unfair charges is done, imho, with a considerable degree of intent to rob

[Soner]

It's just the way it goes here. The "the Computer said NO!" They just do not have the set up in place for when things go wrong. I was charged, years back, approx £200, as someone was stealing my water when I was out of the country. I had to pay, no choice, even after proving I was not in the TRNC for the months that was billed. Recently, my meter packed-in and local Belediye removed it for repair. After being repaired and place back, I lost all my credit that was paid prior to metre being removed, 172Tl. I stated that it needed to be credited back on my metre....but, they simply do not know how to, so I just have to accept and smile along with the staff.

As for air bumping up price of your water, it really cannot be that much money. If you think that you are paying 50p for 1000 litres, what would the air you are paying for add up to in the year??? £2?? £3???

We need to chill and enjoy the sun.

[erol]

As for air bumping up price of your water, it really cannot be that much money. If you think that you are paying 50p for 1000 litres, what would the air you are paying for add up to in the year??? £2?? £3???

Back when I had air issues my monthly water bill went from an an average 50TL over the previous 24 months to 700TL in a single month. I did manage to get this rectified for that single month but only after much persistent effort and eventually showing the videos above to the mayor himself and then only on the basis that they would correct that months bill only and would not correct any future ones and after agreeing to pay for and up front payment card meter to replace the old meter - which did not fix the issue for me but did pretty much fix it for the bele given that I then had to pay for air as if it was water before the fact and not after it.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

It is all too easy to sit behind a screen wherever you are in the world and rap off a few lines without fear of being punched in the kisser like you would in the bar and said the same thing.

How true is that?
Could the air in the pipes be something to do with them altering the pressure to preserve water?
There did used to be a good fiddle with old gas meters that you could do with a hoover and a lot of patience. Also very dangerous unless you knew what you were doing. And the classic put the electricity meter on backwards.

Re criticism of say a restaurant, if its fair then why not? Hopefully the restaurant's satisfied customers will counter and people will get a balanced view. But the criticism has to be fair and not personal because word does fast here and you could kill a person's business.

Personally I try not to critique restaurants unless they are particularly good or different and find some reviews of some pretty average restaurants here quite amusing. "It's a lamb chop and some chips, its not Heston Blumenthal."

Defamation was always a rich man's sport, someone like Robert Maxwell used the threat of defamation to keep a lot of criticism of him out of print. When people say I'll sue....it is always amusing. Not unless you can get access to half a million plus you won't.

The government getting involved and making defamation a criminal rather than civil act might be a good thing or a very dangerous thing.

As for censorship of political views, I’m not a fan of de-platforming or banning speech. It is easy enough to label anything as hate speech tbh and I do believe that often the censors ban, not because they think they view is wrong but because they fear it is correct.
One of the nails in the BNP coffin was Nick Griffin’s appearance on Question Time over many objections. He was revealed to be an odious, sweaty incoherent idiot. Currently we have Tommy Robinson de-platformed and banned from twitter and the like. But if you want to see or hear his views it is still very easy to access them. Maybe people will track them down out of curiosity to see why he is banned. After all it used to be the easiest way to get a number one record was to get it banned from Radio One. Re Robinson, you will see a well produced video where he can advance his views unchallenged. Surely it is better if he is challenged and embarrassed by an Andrew Neil or Jeremy Paxman?

[Up the Reds.]

Yes ETS I think you're right !!

[EnjoyingTheSun]

Yes ETS I think you're right !!

I rarely hear that, so hopefully this post doesn’t disappear before I can print it off and frame it

[Proudsprey]

Proudsprey, if you don't watch it, Soner may offer you a job as a moderator!

I doubt it, you have to have a nasty streak so you can ban people...and I'm too nice

[Charlieboy]

These things happen in a third world country have to get used to it

[jofra]

Legalities....
"Joe Bloggs is corrupt..."
"I Believe Joe Bloggs is corrupt....."
Does belief - in a specific religion or atheism render an individual susceptible to legal action on the grounds of religious discrimination - or belief as to other matters....?

[Proudsprey]

Legalities....
"Joe Bloggs is corrupt..."
"I Believe Joe Bloggs is corrupt....."
Does belief - in a specific religion or atheism render an individual susceptible to legal action on the grounds of religious discrimination - or belief as to other matters....?

The first one is a throwaway, "plucked out of the air" comment that, unless backed up under scrutiny may be held as defamatory or libellous.
The second one infers that the author may have some experience, first hand knowledge or confirmed research about Mr Bloggs' activities that leads the author to hold that belief.
In UK law (as I suspect in many other countries), "I believe" is held in higher regard than "I think" or "I suspect", but will still require authentication by fact in order to prevent litigation.

"Belief" as in a religion is a different noun and, generally, just having a "belief" in a particular religion (or non-religion) is not a pre-cursor to government discrimination (excepting the fact that religious groups are persecuted in various countries around the world). If I say that I am a Buddhist and "believe" in the Buddhist doctrines, that is not a defamatory statement. But if I were to say that "believers" of all religions (or a particular religion/sub-religion) other than Buddhists are terrorists, paedophiles and downright scoundrels, then my "belief" may be regarded as discriminatory and defamatory.
IMHO

[frontalman]

Most people I have dealt with over the sixteen years we have been here, have behaved with honour and respect. I believe you get back what you give out, if you treat people with respect you will get it back. In sixteen years we have never had a problem with being charged for air instead of water. In my view, considering the embargoes and restrictions which the people here have to work through, I think they do pretty well really. Years ago we had power cuts on a daily basis, severe water restrictions throughout the summer, very little choice of food in the shops, etc. All these things have got better over time, as Harold MacMillan said - "You've never had it so good."

[Soner]

Most people I have dealt with over the sixteen years we have been here, have behaved with honour and respect. I believe you get back what you give out, if you treat people with respect you will get it back. In sixteen years we have never had a problem with being charged for air instead of water. In my view, considering the embargoes and restrictions which the people here have to work through, I think they do pretty well really. Years ago we had power cuts on a daily basis, severe water restrictions throughout the summer, very little choice of food in the shops, etc. All these things have got better over time, as Harold MacMillan said - "You've never had it so good."

I remember those days.

[sophie]

So do I Frontal man "the HP sauce boat has docked" So has the baked beans boat!! 4 day/night power cut was the longest. Without water for 6 months and no connection to electricity for even longer. No street lights, and no bin emptying, dead dogs on side of roads and first purchase was a £1000 generator (when £1000 was a great deal of money, its finally packed up) I have to admit the TRNC people those years ago were absolutely lovely (not of course the bar stewards who built our house) they loved to have you sit and chat about the old days and endless photos were produced of old Girne and even older family. That KKTC has more or less vanished, sad to say and I still miss it.

[Keithcaley]

So do I Frontal man "the HP sauce boat has docked" So has the baked beans boat!! 4 day/night power cut was the longest. Without water for 6 months and no connection to electricity for even longer. No street lights, and no bin emptying, dead dogs on side of roads and first purchase was a £1000 generator (when £1000 was a great deal of money, its finally packed up) I have to admit the TRNC people those years ago were absolutely lovely (not of course the bar stewards who built our house) they loved to have you sit and chat about the old days and endless photos were produced of old Girne and even older family. That KKTC has more or less vanished, sad to say and I still miss it.

.


...and nowadays, we can only gaze fondly at the only ageing remnant of the old TRNC that we have left.......................YOU!

[EnjoyingTheSun]

Most people I have dealt with over the sixteen years we have been here, have behaved with honour and respect. I believe you get back what you give out, if you treat people with respect you will get it back. In sixteen years we have never had a problem with being charged for air instead of water.

These days there does seem to be a tendency to blame intent or some conspiracy for everything. The government did this to..or they did this so....
The fact is people make mistakes and cock up.
Strange stuff happens, generally toast lands butter sound down. It doesn’t mean the toast or floor has an agenda.
I think basically humans hate to think that things are out of their control so if something goes wrong and it’s not their fault, who’s fault is it and why are they picking them out.

[Up the Reds.]

There are obviously diverse opinions about any subject and solely because of the draconian laws that are creeping in throughout the western world 'saying what you think' about the elite in power is now scary !! I personally don't buy that Cyprus, both North and South, is better than it was at 20 years ago, but that is my opinion, and of my old buddes! However as my Dad used to say .... THERES TRUTH, LIES AND OPINIONS WHICH ARE NOT NECESSARILY EITHER !!! It's hot and most importantly having a cold Efes !!

[EnjoyingTheSun]

I personally don't buy that Cyprus, both North and South, is better than it was at 20 years ago, but that is my opinion, and of my old buddes!

I think there is always a tendency to remember the past through rose tinted glasses. You remember playing in the snow but forget the freezing cold.

I've only done 4 years and been visiting for 10ish so can't argue with the old timers but I would imagine things like the improved internet are a boon so now you can video call and see grandchildren in UK etc. You can deal with problems in UK online. More choice in the shops?

I also despair when I see another tower block going up next to an empty existing tower block but stupidity isn't a recent innovation.
The UK has certainly declined more over the 4 years since we have been away.

[Up the Reds.]

If you were to meet me EJS 'rose coloured specs' just not something own !!!

[Up the Reds.]

'I own' !

[Kanonier]

So do I Frontal man "the HP sauce boat has docked" So has the baked beans boat!! 4 day/night power cut was the longest. Without water for 6 months and no connection to electricity for even longer. No street lights, and no bin emptying, dead dogs on side of roads and first purchase was a £1000 generator (when £1000 was a great deal of money, its finally packed up) I have to admit the TRNC people those years ago were absolutely lovely (not of course the bar stewards who built our house) they loved to have you sit and chat about the old days and endless photos were produced of old Girne and even older family. That KKTC has more or less vanished, sad to say and I still miss it.

Wakening up in the middle of the night to the sound of water trickling in not having had any for weeks, it was like being a child again on Christmas morning.

[Hedge-fund]

When we were young all the old people used to moan about anything and everything. And bang on about how everything was better in their day.

Ever thought that we may now be the 'old people'?

[EnjoyingTheSun]

When we were young all the old people used to moan about anything and everything. And bang on about how everything was better in their day.

Ever thought that we may now be the 'old people'?

Never!

I like the people the generation before who used to complain that they couldn't use the word gay for happy when they had never used the word gay in their lives.

Much as I envy my grandchildren the kind of stuff they can get now I wouldn't swap my childhood of buying shares in a football with my mates and knocking for people to get a game of football going.
Finding a patch of grass with no ball games allowed and having to keep an eye out for the caretaker.
Thinking back I don't know why we ran away at such a speed when spotted as he was around 80 and smoked 60 Capstans a day wheres we were 11 and played football for 12 hours a day and shared a pack of 10 No.6 between us

[Hedge-fund]

So what you are saying is you are now that caretaker

[frontalman]

When we were young all the old people used to moan about anything and everything. And bang on about how everything was better in their day.

Ever thought that we may now be the 'old people'?

Were you in any doubt??????

[frontalman]

So do I Frontal man "the HP sauce boat has docked" So has the baked beans boat!! 4 day/night power cut was the longest. Without water for 6 months and no connection to electricity for even longer. No street lights, and no bin emptying, dead dogs on side of roads and first purchase was a £1000 generator (when £1000 was a great deal of money, its finally packed up) I have to admit the TRNC people those years ago were absolutely lovely (not of course the bar stewards who built our house) they loved to have you sit and chat about the old days and endless photos were produced of old Girne and even older family. That KKTC has more or less vanished, sad to say and I still miss it.

Wakening up in the middle of the night to the sound of water trickling in not having had any for weeks, it was like being a child again on Christmas morning.

.....and sitting on the roof terrace watching the first thunderstorm of the year bringing much needed rain.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

So what you are saying is you are now that caretaker

Sad but true

[Keithcaley]

So what you are saying is you are now that caretaker

Someone may call 'Off Topic' imminently, but I can't miss the opportunity to recount this -

A pal of mine in the UK, of a similar age, took up the option of a small reduction in his Apartment Rent if he acted as caretaker. He had been growing a 'Full Set' of whiskers, salt and pepper colouring (as he described it), and thought that it added an air of Authority to his appearance - he was really quite pleased with the effect that it had on the young miscreants who created havoc on the forecourt.

Until one day, that is.

He heard a constant thumping from below and realised that the kids were playing football, using one of the shop windows as the goal.

He charged downstairs, and as they scattered, he heard one of the kids shout "Look out, it's SNOWY!"

He shaved it all off that very day

[EnjoyingTheSun]

He charged downstairs, and as they scattered, he heard one of the kids shout "Look out, it's SNOWY!"

He shaved it all off that very day

In my experience I've always found that if someone tells you their nickname and pushes it's because they have a dreadful first name. People call me Mossy usually means my first name is Cecil or suchlike.

Nickname's are usually apt and ever so slightly cruel I find.

There was a guy I used to play football with, that we called Klaus.
He used to always try the worst overhead kicks you could see which would always end with him collapsing on the floor after making zero contact with the ball.
Anyhow there was a well known player of the era, Klaus Fischer, who was famous for carrying out his better executed overhead kicks so it was a natural,
At first he thought it was a compliment but soon learnt to hate it.

I bumped into him many years later with his wife in a restaurant and he called out my name and I of course called out Klaus as his real name had long been made redundant and I couldn't have recalled it with a gun to my head.
His wife laughed and his face collapsed but I meant no malice, I was thrilled to remember his face.

I'd love to have heard how he explained the name to his Mrs. "Well I was a big fan of the author Klaus Mann and.........."

[Brinsley]

My post has certainly developed!

Charging for air when it should be water IS A CON AND RIPOFF!

If mistakes happen irrespective of what class of world status, the Government should apologise, reimburse and rectify. If they are in denial with good evidence to the contrary they are corrupt scammers!

[Up the Reds.]

Totally agree Brinsley. I still have the problem after 20 years so only turn the stopcock on when I prove there's water incoming. After filling my 5 ton tank I turn the stopcock off again until perhaps 3 or 4 days later and so on. The Bele sent someone up on more than one occasion but of course when water was freeflowing !!! If I leave the stopcock on permanently I can lose many tons in a month !! The endless excuses for inefficiency and the 'shrug' are just that..excuses !!