Three cheers for Brexit

[sophie]

In my case I feel that "mop head" is one of the most disappointing Tory politicians for years and if I had a vote I would have voted for him at the time!! He and Cameron sold the Brits down the tubes. Still, they can rest assured they will still be supported by their Uni cronies and the Exclusive Societies they were associated with.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

So we sent an Eton educated 'Benny Hill' to rescue the most important trade talks of modern times. The most untrustworthy man in the country who is more interested in protecting the interests of his chums than the future prosperity of the nation. Why any seasoned European politicians could be expected to take this buffoon seriously is baffling. He has lied to just about everybody from his employers, the queen, parliament and the public and shown the world that he is prepared to renege on any agreement with his 'Internal Market Bill'.
Still, the menu for his dinner with Ursula sounded very appetising, a starter of Scallops and the main, Turbot! Pity they didn't come with a country of origin.

Think you should take a few days off from The Guardian mate.
As for this obsession with Eton, personally I went to a bog standard inner London comprehensive but I'm not wracked with jealousy at those that went to Eton or private.
Generally you'll be hard pressed to find many front bench MPs in any party who didn't go to private school. Those that didn't generally use their expenses to send THEIR kids private no matter how much they rail against private schools.
The Stalinst Seamus Milne went to Winchester which is more expensive than Eton and his kids go either private or selective. Clement Attlee who was the greatest Labour Prime Minister came from a privileged background and went to a public school.

I think at the last count only about 3% of Labour MPs had held a job which involved manual Labour, those that held a proper job of course.
The days of a Bevan leaving the pits to become an MP have long since past so all you have now are 'seasoned' politicians who have never been in the real world. Whilst left wing activists stir up class jealousy their own backgrounds don't bear much scrutiny hence their published bios are kept deliberately scant and their mockney accents don't make them working class.

[Medjoul1]

Whats the relevance of the Guardian, never read it. Don't enjoy the Sun much either.

[waz-24-7]

I reckon the little French twerp, is anxious to have the French National Anthem adopted by the rest of Europe (at least that's the way he behaves) He must be swearing in his sleep to realise the Brits are not going to dance to his tune. NO WAY!!

Brits could turn back to cheddar if the price of French cheese shoots up after a no-deal Brexit.
Tesco's chairman John Allan told the BBC that tariffs could push up the price of brie by as much as 40%.
He said it might "change the mix of what people eat", leading to people buying more British cheddar.

Yes
of course we could relatively easily stop eating French cheese, driving German cars or indeed purchasing anything from the EU. Perhaps the Belgian COVID vaccine will be the first to be hit with import tariff.

However that is not the most critical point.
The UK economy , standard of living , welfare and general prosperity is earnt via earning offshore dollars, That is EXPORT, EXPORT and EXPORT more to bring new money into the internal inshore pot. Its easy to simply circulate money within the internal economy. Import of goods and services to the UK simply provide an additional level of choice and service and essentially export revenue to the countries of origin.

Now many will respond by saying "they" will lose more than "us". This too is not the point as its is not a simple game of poker and winner takes all.
The situation currently is extremely damaging to the UK during a very difficult period anyway,

On Sunday. Without a trade deal. I expect, as many do, severe loss in all aspects of trade, prosperity, choice and service.
This is incidentally all on top of loss of, taken for granted , freedoms. Travel, healthcare, security , insurances and citizenship.

[Dalartokat]

Dominic Raab, the Foreign Secretary, has today been on a couple of radio stations stressing people from the U.K. travelling to Europe after 31/12/20 could be disrupted due to individual Countries and their entry rules for Covid-19 . I don’t think that there has been an interview quite like today, where the presenters have had to prod and probe as much to get him to outline exactly what he means, but although this link explains, he found it difficult to do the same. There are a lot of people on other forums, Facebook etc. that seem to believe that 2021 will be back to normal and start their holidays again, especially to Northern Cyprus via the South side either because there will be a vaccination or because going to the South side is what they have always done or for some reason cannot go to Ercan. The fact that he has just decided to put it out there and obviously, at the moment, the Brexit talks are not going to plan, it could end up being disappointing for some. Then again, it all could run smoothly.


https://www.expressandstar.com/news/uk- ... on-period/

[Hedge-fund]

The UK and eu are now two competing independent sovereign areas.

Nothing will be the same.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

Whats the relevance of the Guardian, never read it. Don't enjoy the Sun much either.

I don't read either and didn't go to Eton but I've learned to live with it

[erol]

Generally you'll be hard pressed to find many front bench MPs in any party who didn't go to private school.

Exactly. Or senior judges or civil servants or ceo's or or or

Nor is this an issue just of 'equity' or 'fairness' or the systematic undermining of meritocracy, though that is problematic enough in itself. These institutions turn out individuals damaged to a greater degree than otherwise, emotionally and in terms of belief in their privilege and specialness and difference from the rest of us and then we put them in charge of everything. They are designed and structured to do this. It is a problem. There are solutions to such problems but as long as people like you go around ignoring it, diminishing it and diverting from it then it is likely to remain a problem. Just look at Johnson. He is a damaged individual and the roots of that damage connect directly back to how and where he was educated as far as I am concerned. Nor is he an exception, this is more often than not the norm.

Such concerns are valid and real imo and dismissing any mention of them out of hand as being just 'jealousy' is just plain lazy imo.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

Generally you'll be hard pressed to find many front bench MPs in any party who didn't go to private school.

Exactly. Or senior judges or civil servants or ceo's or or or

Nor is this an issue just of 'equity' or 'fairness' or the systematic undermining of meritocracy, though that is problematic enough in itself. These institutions turn out individuals damaged to a greater degree than otherwise, emotionally and in terms of belief in their privilege and specialness and difference from the rest of us and then we put them in charge of everything. They are designed and structured to do this. It is a problem. There are solutions to such problems but as long as people like you go around ignoring it, diminishing it and diverting from it then it is likely to remain a problem. Just look at Johnson. He is a damaged individual and the roots of that damage connect directly back to how and where he was educated as far as I am concerned. Nor is he an exception, this is more often than not the norm.

Such concerns are valid and real imo and dismissing any mention of them out of hand as being just 'jealousy' is just plain lazy imo.

So every MP, judge, civil servant, CEO is bad?
They are as good or as flawed as the rest of us nothing to do with what school they went to.
To do those sort of jobs you need a certain level of education what the state sector isn’t supplying. Our schooling system is more interested in looking after the interests of the teachers not the children.
Rather than improve state education the left just want to complain about private education. Obviously it’s lip service as they make liberal use of it themselves.
The main moan is the charitable status of private schools which costs £100 million a year. Obviously you would have to factor the net cost as those parents who are availing themselves of the private sector are still paying in for state education. If their kids go to the state schools the tax payer pays more money.
Ok we wipe out private schools and throw the £100 million into the state sector. We spend £100 billion on it and it isn’t very good £100 million won’t make a dent.
Interestingly the same people who cry over this £100 million will write off the £300 million spent on health tourist as such an insignificant sum as it hardly matters.
Standards? Mine’s a double.

Two factors here.
There is always an elite and always will be under whatever system you use. You don’t think Stalin’s kids went to the same school as a coal miner do you?
The other thing is people are entitled to spend their money how they wish. They have after all discharged their responsibility to the state by paying their taxes which go into the state education system which they are not using.

If the plan is to punish the elite then forget it. They will simply send their kids to the relocated Eton in Switzerland. You will punish a lot of ordinary people who make sacrifices to send their kids to a non Eton private school.

It’s the usual politics of envy or maybe there is some bitter school rivalry between Eton and Winchester.

There is a solution, improve state education. I've yet to be convinced that letting down the tyres of someone's Ferrari will make my crappy Nissan run any better

[erol]

Have moved the discussion about british public school system here viewtopic.php?f=71&t=53178

but Ill just say you can not be envious of something you yourself had. Keep dismissing everything I as an individual say if you like using your lazy 'politics of envy' but envy is nothing to do with my views on british public schools. Compassion would be nearer the mark.

[Hedge-fund]

Have moved the discussion about british public school system here viewtopic.php?f=71&t=53178

but Ill just say you can not be envious of something you yourself had. Keep dismissing everything I as an individual say if you like using your lazy 'politics of envy' but envy is nothing to do with my views on british public schools. Compassion would be nearer the mark.

I thought you had left admin due to bullying

[EnjoyingTheSun]

I thought you had left admin due to bullying

Sounds like a cue for another new thread

[erol]

Have moved the discussion about british public school system here viewtopic.php?f=71&t=53178

but Ill just say you can not be envious of something you yourself had. Keep dismissing everything I as an individual say if you like using your lazy 'politics of envy' but envy is nothing to do with my views on british public schools. Compassion would be nearer the mark.

I thought you had left admin due to bullying

I moved the discussion as a normal ordinary user trying to behave in ways that did not upset people by not being about brexit whilst allowing the discussion on public schools to continue in a new thread with me as thread starter. No mod or admin functions needed. From my time as an admin, here and on countless other forums, I know if more people were to behave with such consideration then much of the spats mods and admins are forced to clean up over 'off topic' would be less.

So you think I stopped being a mod here because of bullying do you ? Bullying of me or by me ?

[Hedge-fund]

Have moved the discussion about british public school system here viewtopic.php?f=71&t=53178

but Ill just say you can not be envious of something you yourself had. Keep dismissing everything I as an individual say if you like using your lazy 'politics of envy' but envy is nothing to do with my views on british public schools. Compassion would be nearer the mark.

I thought you had left admin due to bullying

I moved the discussion as a normal ordinary user trying to behave in ways that did not upset people by not being about brexit whilst allowing the discussion on public schools to continue in a new thread with me as thread starter. No mod or admin functions needed. From my time as an admin, here and on countless other forums, I know if more people were to behave with such consideration then much of the spats mods and admins are forced to clean up over 'off topic' would be less.

So you think I stopped being a mod here because of bullying do you ? Bullying of me or by me ?

How do you move posts? Can any poster do it?

You were pulled up attacking an elderly female poster.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

but Ill just say you can not be envious of something you yourself had. Keep dismissing everything I as an individual say if you like using your lazy 'politics of envy' but envy is nothing to do with my views on british public schools. Compassion would be nearer the mark.

But you wish to remove the choice from others?
Anything else you want to tell people to do with their money?
I’m up for banning Vauxhalls if you’ll support me? Worst car I ever had

[erol]

I thought you had left admin due to bullying

I moved the discussion as a normal ordinary user trying to behave in ways that did not upset people by not being about brexit whilst allowing the discussion on public schools to continue in a new thread with me as thread starter. No mod or admin functions needed. From my time as an admin, here and on countless other forums, I know if more people were to behave with such consideration then much of the spats mods and admins are forced to clean up over 'off topic' would be less.

So you think I stopped being a mod here because of bullying do you ? Bullying of me or by me ?

How do you move posts? Can any poster do it?

You were pulled up attacking an elderly female poster.

Nothing was moved other than the discussion. No posts were moved at all. I am in a thread that is about Brexit. A side discussion starts about public schools. I do not post my reply on public schools in that thread. I start a new thread in the appropriate forum section and move the discussion about public schools there and then say that is what I have done in the original thread about Brexit. No use of or need for mod power just a bit of consideration for trying to upset as few people unnecessarily as possible.

As for you allegation that I stopped being a mod here because I was "pulled up attacking an elderly female poster" that is as entirely untrue and unfounded as your suspicion that you had 'caught me out' using mod powers. Still you carry on with your scurrilous attacks on and lies about my character and integrity from the safety of your anonymous pseudonym. I will ignore such from now on with the disdain and contempt it deserves.

[erol]

but Ill just say you can not be envious of something you yourself had. Keep dismissing everything I as an individual say if you like using your lazy 'politics of envy' but envy is nothing to do with my views on british public schools. Compassion would be nearer the mark.

But you wish to remove the choice from others?
Anything else you want to tell people to do with their money?
I’m up for banning Vauxhalls if you’ll support me? Worst car I ever had

I am up for telling people they can not buy children with their money nor can they sell them. Are you up for that ? Or is that too much limitation on what people should be allowed to do with their money ?

[EnjoyingTheSun]

but Ill just say you can not be envious of something you yourself had. Keep dismissing everything I as an individual say if you like using your lazy 'politics of envy' but envy is nothing to do with my views on british public schools. Compassion would be nearer the mark.

But you wish to remove the choice from others?
Anything else you want to tell people to do with their money?
I’m up for banning Vauxhalls if you’ll support me? Worst car I ever had

I am up for telling people they can not buy children with their money nor can they sell them. Are you up for that ? Or is that too much limitation on what people should be allowed to do with their money ?

So child slavery, buying heroin etc is the same as private education in your mind? Ludicrous argument

[erol]

But you wish to remove the choice from others?
Anything else you want to tell people to do with their money?
I’m up for banning Vauxhalls if you’ll support me? Worst car I ever had

I am up for telling people they can not buy children with their money nor can they sell them. Are you up for that ? Or is that too much limitation on what people should be allowed to do with their money ?

So child slavery, buying heroin etc is the same as private education in your mind? Ludicrous argument

The ludicrous argument is that nothing should be proscribed because people must be free to spend their money how they want.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

I am up for telling people they can not buy children with their money nor can they sell them. Are you up for that ? Or is that too much limitation on what people should be allowed to do with their money ?

So child slavery, buying heroin etc is the same as private education in your mind? Ludicrous argument

The ludicrous argument is that nothing should be proscribed because people must be free to spend their money how they want.

If it's legal.
I know you guys are desperate to totally override the family and get hold of those kid's minds but I veer towards letting parents take care of their children and make choices.
I know its votes and god knows the party needs them but maybe they could simply pop up North, ask around, see what's on the minds of the people and who knows miraculously you might find that Palestine or trans rights isn't the vote winner you thought it was? Just a thought.

[Brinsley]

12 midnight 1st January 2021, the traditional Scottish song should be replaced from, "Auld Lang Syne" to...............


https://youtu.be/cem38_KjipU

Happy days ahead for the nationalist, isolationists!

[Hedge-fund]

I moved the discussion as a normal ordinary user trying to behave in ways that did not upset people by not being about brexit whilst allowing the discussion on public schools to continue in a new thread with me as thread starter. No mod or admin functions needed. From my time as an admin, here and on countless other forums, I know if more people were to behave with such consideration then much of the spats mods and admins are forced to clean up over 'off topic' would be less.

So you think I stopped being a mod here because of bullying do you ? Bullying of me or by me ?

How do you move posts? Can any poster do it?

You were pulled up attacking an elderly female poster.

Nothing was moved other than the discussion. No posts were moved at all. I am in a thread that is about Brexit. A side discussion starts about public schools. I do not post my reply on public schools in that thread. I start a new thread in the appropriate forum section and move the discussion about public schools there and then say that is what I have done in the original thread about Brexit. No use of or need for mod power just a bit of consideration for trying to upset as few people unnecessarily as possible.

As for you allegation that I stopped being a mod here because I was "pulled up attacking an elderly female poster" that is as entirely untrue and unfounded as your suspicion that you had 'caught me out' using mod powers. Still you carry on with your scurrilous attacks on and lies about my character and integrity from the safety of your anonymous pseudonym. I will ignore such from now on with the disdain and contempt it deserves.

Your choice of words was poor so I asked a question which you have answered. There was no 'caught me out' - and I didn't use those words so the speech marks are again poor use of grammar.

If you had been made admin again I would have taken it up with Soner.

As for your disgraceful attack it is here...


viewtopic.php?f=8&t=48522&p=236637#p236637

....and this rightly led, via a few essays and an attention seeking poll, to you leaving admin.

I'm happy for you to waste time and effort on here for as long as you want and I will ignore it but if I see bullying of an elderly lady I will get involved.

As for an anonymous pseudonyn, I don't believe it wise or compulsory to use your name on every internet forum. My contact details are there for anyone to use.

I have offered to meet over a pint before when you were kicking off about cat food so I'm hardly a shrinking violet.

[erol]

As for your disgraceful attack it is here...

You appear to show as evidence a link to your own previous post where you had earlier accused me of disgraceful bullying but in neither that post or this one have you shown the actually bullying itself. You are entitled to an opinion on if my behaviour was or is disgraceful or not but if you are going to declare it as such then show where. Link to my post that shows this, not yours accusing me of it. Just making the accusation is not good enough.

....and this rightly led, via a few essays and an attention seeking poll, to you leaving admin.

The decision to stop moderating here was mine. That has already been confirmed by Soner publicly back then. There is absolutely no link between me making that decision and your alleged 'disgusting bullying of an elderly lady'. I decided to stop helping with moderation because I was tired. Tired of being threatened by a particular user who did not like my views with being 'exposed' for something that was not covert but just irrelevant. Tired of accusations and insinuations of manipulation and deceit and un fair play by as a moderator. Tired of coming to the forum and moving posts in to sections they should have been posted in in the first place only to be accused of bias and censorship and not moderating fairly. Tired of the whole thing. I am increasingly becoming tired of even posting at all given responses like this. You could almost make out it is a form of bullying against me. If you wanted to be a total drama queen that is.

I'm happy for you to waste time and effort on here for as long as you want and I will ignore it but if I see bullying of an elderly lady I will get involved.

I am happy for you to virtual signal your knight in shinning white armour credentials even as you use them as an cover to justify your scurrilous attacks on me as a person.

As for an anonymous pseudonyn, I don't believe it wise or compulsory to use your name on every internet forum. My contact details are there for anyone to use.

No it probably is best to hide your real world identity if you are going to go around making the kind of accusations and attacks on me you have given the actual reality. What you describe as a disgraceful bullying attack on an elderly lady I describe as a frank and sincere attempt at an adult conversation on a sensitive topic with another adult.

I have offered to meet over a pint before when you were kicking off about cat food so I'm hardly a shrinking violet.

I have no memory of such an offer. Does not mean it was not made but I have no memory of it. I am always willing to meet in person. Try again.

[erol]

Your choice of words was poor so I asked a question which you have answered. There was no 'caught me out' - and I didn't use those words so the speech marks are again poor use of grammar.

Your choice of understanding was poor so you asked a question that implied I must have used 'mod powers'. I answer it and explained I had not. You then asked asked the question again with the same implication again, clearly not finding my first answer satisfactory enough. I answered again . As for my grammar have you ever heard of 'air quotes' ? See I just did it again. I am not suggesting you said "air quotes". See ?

[PoshinDevon]

This post has drifted so far off topic it has now been locked.