Covid, anti vaxers

[thornaby]

Have no issue with them refusing to have the jabs, but have a massive issue with them mixing with other people. Know of several venues who don't care about thes people entering their premises when they know they people are not inoculated, profit before people. My message to the anti vaxes, stay at home, dont put my families welfare at risk.

[benjaminbutton]

Ditto and you can't work in the Health Care industry either.

[Hammerhead]

It's the big divide,lots don't trust the vaccine

[thornaby]

Hammerhead, not trusting the vaccine should be your choice, but it should not be your choice to be in public places. Vaccines have brought down the mortality rate dramatically, yes you can still catch covid but the chances of either dying from it or even ending up in an itu bed on life support have been massively reduced.

[benjaminbutton]

I watched a load of young anti vax teenagers and early 20's being interviewed this week and everyone without exception said they obtained their information and hence made their decision, after studying Social Media. Sad really when Social Media becomes the greatest purveyor of mis-information.

[Deniz1]

CNN have fired people for going to the office unvaccinated.

[snd1966]

Maybe I am completely wrong but i assumed the vaccine only offers a protection not actually prevent you from catching it

If you have had the jab, you have a better chance of surviving with less life changing illnesses but one can still catch, carry and spread covid
People who have not had the jab have to be more conscience on who they are surrounded by, keep their own personal hygiene to a very high standard as if they catch covid their body may not be able to fight it as well as someone who has had the jab.

I, personally would rather be in a room with people who have a negative pcr test than jabbed people but at the moment I still rather not be in any room and keep my distance from jabbed or un jabbed people.

Unfortunately people do not have a tattoo on their forehead to state whether they are carrying it whether vaccinated or not.

and politeness if you feel unwell with anything wear your mask properly, very worrying I have not even had a cold for over 2 years

[muzza]

You can tell me to mind my own business if you want as I live in the south, but would like to ask if you have access to the Co-vid vaccination Cert pass (safe pass) in the north.
Just mentioning it as here in the south, if you don't have the safe pass cert you are not permitted to enter Supermarkets, cafes , bars etc.ect.
If the safe pass system is in place, & there are venues ignoring it, then I suggest they should be named & shamed.
I would certainly like to know if a venue was ignoring the system, & letting people in not knowing if they had been double jabbed or not, because I definitely would not be entering that venue.

[a1sysman]

You can tell me to mind my own business if you want as I live in the south, but would like to ask if you have access to the Co-vid vaccination Cert pass (safe pass) in the north.
Just mentioning it as here in the south, if you don't have the safe pass cert you are not permitted to enter Supermarkets, cafes , bars etc.ect.
If the safe pass system is in place, & there are venues ignoring it, then I suggest they should be named & shamed.
I would certainly like to know if a venue was ignoring the system, & letting people in not knowing if they had been double jabbed or not, because I definitely would not be entering that venue.

The TRNC health ministry has released a tool to generate a document (AdaPass) for those who have received two doses of vaccine under the TRNC health ministry Covid vaccination programme. See here https://adapass.gov.ct.tr/

Whilst some TRNC government, utility and council offices are requiring proof of double dose vaccination and current Covid negative proof (PCR or antigen) before granting access, and the rules for entering indoor public spaces also require similar proof / checking, from personal experience only, I would say this is not managed as efficiently in the north as I have seen and experienced in Nicosia recently.

[muzza]

Thanks for the reply a1sysman.
It's a shame that not all establishments are checking the AdaPass, it's certainty a bit of a mine field there at the moment.
I like crossing over now again for shopping & eating out, but I'm afraid until the establishments get to grips with the AdaPass, I will remain here in the south.
Take care .

[Keithcaley]

Thanks for the reply a1sysman.
It's a shame that not all establishments are checking the AdaPass, it's certainty a bit of a mine field there at the moment.
I like crossing over now again for shopping & eating out, but I'm afraid until the establishments get to grips with the AdaPass, I will remain here in the south.
Take care .

I can't say that I altogether blame you!

Do you happen to know what the take-up on vaccinations is like in the South?

[kibsolar1999]

Thanks for the reply a1sysman.
It's a shame that not all establishments are checking the AdaPass, it's certainty a bit of a mine field there at the moment.
I like crossing over now again for shopping & eating out, but I'm afraid until the establishments get to grips with the AdaPass, I will remain here in the south.
Take care .

I can't say that I altogether blame you!

Do you happen to know what the take-up on vaccinations is like in the South?

https://news.gtp.gr/2021/08/02/one-thir ... -covid-19/
i would say you can transfer that to all of Cyprus and Turkey as well....

[waz-24-7]

There should absolutely no confusion or misunderstanding upon the seriousness of Covid.
The SARS group of viral infections , covid included, has been a threat to humans for some years. The SARS viral family and particularly Covid 19 has mutated in order to succeed and prosper.
It has successfully been able to now infect and transmit within humans having probably started life within a wild animal population. This infection/transmission success now allows it to become global...after all humans are a global host species.

We have commenced the fight back . Under duress and with unprecedented speed we have entered into war with this organism. The design and release of vaccines is our weaponry. We are armed and ready. The battlefield is global. The prize to the victor is survival. The virus is certainly aware that it is under attack. Its rate of mutation is a desperate struggle to survive and counter attack against the weapons of the primary host.

Like it or not we are, without exception , on the battlefield. Many of us are armed and ready, wearing flack jackets and hard hats (double vaccinated). Some wander the battlefield naked and exposed but feel their verbose objections and gesticulations will somehow secure exemplary status. They will not. They simply provide a soft belly of opportunity for the organism to mutate further and strengthen its ability to re group and counter attack.
This virus will take your health or possibly your life without a blink. It has absolutely no regard for human rights, freedoms of choice or any other human intellect. It is fighting for its life.
Get vaccinated and be prepared for the long haul. The virus and its mutants will be around for a very long time and the anti vaxers are doing the war effort no favours.

[Dalartokat]

Or….you could have just said quoting you….

Get vaccinated and be prepared for the long haul. The virus and its mutants will be around for a very long time.

[Brazen]

There should absolutely no confusion or misunderstanding upon the seriousness of Covid.
The SARS group of viral infections , covid included, has been a threat to humans for some years. The SARS viral family and particularly Covid 19 has mutated in order to succeed and prosper.
It has successfully been able to now infect and transmit within humans having probably started life within a wild animal population. This infection/transmission success now allows it to become global...after all humans are a global host species.

We have commenced the fight back . Under duress and with unprecedented speed we have entered into war with this organism. The design and release of vaccines is our weaponry. We are armed and ready. The battlefield is global. The prize to the victor is survival. The virus is certainly aware that it is under attack. Its rate of mutation is a desperate struggle to survive and counter attack against the weapons of the primary host.

Like it or not we are, without exception , on the battlefield. Many of us are armed and ready, wearing flack jackets and hard hats (double vaccinated). Some wander the battlefield naked and exposed but feel their verbose objections and gesticulations will somehow secure exemplary status. They will not. They simply provide a soft belly of opportunity for the organism to mutate further and strengthen its ability to re group and counter attack.
This virus will take your health or possibly your life without a blink. It has absolutely no regard for human rights, freedoms of choice or any other human intellect. It is fighting for its life.
Get vaccinated and be prepared for the long haul. The virus and its mutants will be around for a very long time and the anti vaxers are doing the war effort no favours.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

Have no issue with them refusing to have the jabs, but have a massive issue with them mixing with other people. Know of several venues who don't care about thes people entering their premises when they know they people are not inoculated, profit before people. My message to the anti vaxes, stay at home, dont put my families welfare at risk.

Apparently if you've had the vaccine your not going to get seriously ill or die so I wouldn't worry.
As for these venues, vote with your feet. If you feel unsafe there don't go to them.

[Chriswright03]

Have no issue with them refusing to have the jabs, but have a massive issue with them mixing with other people. Know of several venues who don't care about thes people entering their premises when they know they people are not inoculated, profit before people. My message to the anti vaxes, stay at home, dont put my families welfare at risk.

Apparently if you've had the vaccine your not going to get seriously ill or die so I wouldn't worry.
As for these venues, vote with your feet. If you feel unsafe there don't go to them.

Not strictly true that is it? You 'may' not get seriously ill but some still may and then they may die. It isn't as clear cut as you make out which is the sort of misinformation that helps no one at all. Also you can still contract the virus and then of course you would have to go into quarantine be it at home or a centre which is an inconvenience to say the least. Not forgetting of course that if you do catch it you can pass it on to others.

I do agree with the second part though and we don't go to places where we see an obvious lack of care.

[snd1966]

One has to take care of oneself but I do feel sorry for people who have not been vaccinated and wondering when they will have a L tattooed on their forehead and a bell around their neck. Most realise they maybe will become seriously ill if they catch covid and are very aware of their surroundings.
Fear is a great human trait and wow isn't it being fed at the moment.
As I said in my earlier post I rather be in my own company and have my space ... or people who have a valid pcr test than a person who thinks they can't catch or spread it as they are vaccinated

[EnjoyingTheSun]

Not strictly true that is it? You 'may' not get seriously ill but some still may and then they may die. It isn't as clear cut as you make out which is the sort of misinformation that helps no one at all. Also you can still contract the virus and then of course you would have to go into quarantine be it at home or a centre which is an inconvenience to say the least. Not forgetting of course that if you do catch it you can pass it on to others.

So you can still get seriously ill, particularly if you are old or have underlying health problems I assume?
And you can still pass it on?

I am not an anti vaxxer by any means but before the vaccines became available I said that undoubtedly some would be better than others. Not an unreasonable observation I thought but I got the usual pile on by the usual suspects.

Now with time the data seems to show that there are more adverse reactions to the Astra Zeneca vaccine than other vaccines.
Maybe with more time more adverse reactions will become apparent because be under no illusions we are undergoing the largest human drug trial in history.
For my part I have no problem getting vaccinated but I don’t appreciate being forced into a hasty decision on what vaccine to eventually take or being forced to take a vaccine that I am not comfortable with purely due to supply.

Personally I think the wearing of masks has negligible benefits but I wear one when out for others comfort rather than my own. I don’t go out that much and socially distance but I think people have lost their minds over this virus.
We started off that we would vaccinate the vulnerable but I would pay good money that children being vaccinated will become compulsory.

I haven’t met many virologists or climatologists in my time but I have met a lot of con men. Some very good con men. I’ve seen long cons, short cons, big cons and small cons but there is one constant, con men press gang you make quick uninformed decisions because that is the only way they can make money so I am never rushed into anything.

If you think getting vaccinated as soon as possible is best for you and your whole family then take that path but respect others who don’t choose that path.
After all if you are vaccinated and they are not, you are a much higher risk to them then they are to you?

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... rd-reports

[EnjoyingTheSun]

One has to take care of oneself but I do feel sorry for people who have not been vaccinated and wondering when they will have a L tattooed on their forehead and a bell around their neck. Most realise they maybe will become seriously ill if they catch covid and are very aware of their surroundings.
Fear is a great human trait and wow isn't it being fed at the moment.

Maybe some kind of star on their clothing, that was very effective at one time?

It is ironic that many who think themselves as tolerant, anti-bullying, anti fascist, anti racist, pro democracy, pro human rights, pro free speech etc etc etc take on some of the worst characteristics of those they profess to be against but then I suppose by the same token nobody minds the smell of their own farts.

[forestpixie]

Not strictly true that is it? You 'may' not get seriously ill but some still may and then they may die. It isn't as clear cut as you make out which is the sort of misinformation that helps no one at all. Also you can still contract the virus and then of course you would have to go into quarantine be it at home or a centre which is an inconvenience to say the least. Not forgetting of course that if you do catch it you can pass it on to others.

So you can still get seriously ill, particularly if you are old or have underlying health problems I assume?
And you can still pass it on?

I am not an anti vaxxer by any means but before the vaccines became available I said that undoubtedly some would be better than others. Not an unreasonable observation I thought but I got the usual pile on by the usual suspects.

Now with time the data seems to show that there are more adverse reactions to the Astra Zeneca vaccine than other vaccines.
Maybe with more time more adverse reactions will become apparent because be under no illusions we are undergoing the largest human drug trial in history.
For my part I have no problem getting vaccinated but I don’t appreciate being forced into a hasty decision on what vaccine to eventually take or being forced to take a vaccine that I am not comfortable with purely due to supply.

Personally I think the wearing of masks has negligible benefits but I wear one when out for others comfort rather than my own. I don’t go out that much and socially distance but I think people have lost their minds over this virus.
We started off that we would vaccinate the vulnerable but I would pay good money that children being vaccinated will become compulsory.

I haven’t met many virologists or climatologists in my time but I have met a lot of con men. Some very good con men. I’ve seen long cons, short cons, big cons and small cons but there is one constant, con men press gang you make quick uninformed decisions because that is the only way they can make money so I am never rushed into anything.

If you think getting vaccinated as soon as possible is best for you and your whole family then take that path but respect others who don’t choose that path.
After all if you are vaccinated and they are not, you are a much higher risk to them then they are to you?

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... rd-reports

Well said "Enjoyingthesun"

[Chriswright03]

For the record I don't think the vaccine should be compulsory. I am more concerned about the misinformation that is all over social media which feeds the two sides and splits them further apart rather than bring them closer together.

Everyone should be able to make up their own mind as to whether they want to be vaccinated but it would be helpful if there was some absolute trustworthy source to help them decide which option to take. Only this week I read my news feed and saw some UK expert was saying that the Pandemic is behind us and then two days later a different UK Expert stated exactly the opposite. How does that assist the man in the street to make and informed decision?

I think the concern here at the moment should be why are the numbers increasing at the rate they are? 188 new cases yesterday which is the highest daily rate so far. Whilst the figures given include things like how many are in hospital, how many are in ICU and how many have recovered. What they are not showing is how many that tested positive are actually double vaccinated? Also out of those how many are seriously ill or have died? That sort of information would be more useful and may actually assist people to make informed decisions.

Having said all of the above whose figures do we trust if any?

[waz-24-7]

The global vaccination programme should not be considered as a singular or individual one. The Virus will survive, spread , mutate and strengthen just as long as host tissue is readily available. Anti vaxers and abstainers are the weak link in the defence chain and now we are clearly seeing them in hospital. The current Delta variant is the most successful strain to date..in less than 20 months. Whilst Covid remains within the community the next stronger variant will be in the design stage. I expect booster and modified vaccines will become similarly designed and planned to keep the fight alive.
I'm guessing the vast majority on this forum are taking the sensible and responsible path and getting vaccinated.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

For the record I don't think the vaccine should be compulsory. I am more concerned about the misinformation that is all over social media which feeds the two sides and splits them further apart rather than bring them closer together.

Everyone should be able to make up their own mind as to whether they want to be vaccinated but it would be helpful if there was some absolute trustworthy source to help them decide which option to take. Only this week I read my news feed and saw some UK expert was saying that the Pandemic is behind us and then two days later a different UK Expert stated exactly the opposite. How does that assist the man in the street to make and informed decision?

I think the driving people apart is a sad reflection of the times tbh.
I think from day one the whole covid thing got politicised. It was a great stick to beat the governments over the head with.
No government made zero mistakes and some made more than others but if you are in opposition you can Monday morning quarterback the life out of it.

You only have to look at America. When Trump was in power the media would lovingly report every death in the US as they tried to blame him for them all.
Since Biden has been in there has barely been a word, so we can only assume Biden cured the virus overnight?

Tbh I treat any of the figures with some skepticism especially since I hear when the advance reports that the statistics for suicides in the U.K. and US for 2020 are going to see a drop.
I know someone who has quite a high up job on the railways in Scotland who says the number of people jumping in front of trains has quadrupled. I have no reason to think he is making that up but you may not trust my anecdotal evidence but logic tells me with people losing jobs, losing their homes, not seeing families or friends for months and the mental toll of lockdown the suicide rate falling does not ring true.

I think the concern here at the moment should be why are the numbers increasing at the rate they are? 188 new cases yesterday which is the highest daily rate so far. Whilst the figures given include things like how many are in hospital, how many are in ICU and how many have recovered. What they are not showing is how many that tested positive are actually double vaccinated? Also out of those how many are seriously ill or have died? That sort of information would be more useful and may actually assist people to make informed decisions.

Having said all of the above whose figures do we trust if any?

The problem with statistics is they can always be massaged or misinterpreted. Covid cases going up is reported covid cases going up so more people are being tested and the vaccine it’s self may cause a spike.
Also governments do need to justify their actions so some creative accountancy will help in that.

A lot of it comes down to how you interpret the data. To give an example years ago there was a statistic that 1 in 2 marriages were ending in divorce. On the face of it the figure was accurate if you compared the year’s marriages to the year’s divorces but there was a story within that told a different story.
Divorce had become much easier so couples who had lived together for 20 years in misery could now part ways so the number had a lot of historical marriages contained within it. Also marriage rates were going down so coupled with a backlog of people who finally could part company that skewed the figures considerably. So the statement was trueish but the underlying message was very inaccurate in that 50% of the year’s marriages were likely to end in divorce.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

Anti vaxers and abstainers are the weak link in the defence chain and now we are clearly seeing them in hospital.

So the vast majority of the people who are being hospitalised with covid are those who haven’t been vaccinated?

So Sir Patrick Vallance, the UK’s chief scientific adviser didn’t announce that around 40% of people being admitted to hospital with COVID in the UK have been vaccinated which given the vaccination programme would account for the spike wouldn’t it?

[muzza]

People still not getting vaccinated, don't understand the logic myself

This was in the Cyprus Mail yesterday,

Amalia Hadjiyianni, Scientific Director of the Famagusta and Larnaca hospitals, has said that 89% of the patients at the Famagusta General Hospital, which is operating as a coronavirus reference hospital, have not been vaccinated.

Hadjiyianni said that currently there are 66 patients at the Reference Hospital, six in the Increased Care Unit. The youngest patient is 32 years old and the oldest is 92. The patients’ median age is 60 years.

She noted that “yesterday we have had several admission in the Hospital. Some 89% of the patients being treated here have not bee vaccinated against Covid-19.

[forestpixie]

For the record I don't think the vaccine should be compulsory. I am more concerned about the misinformation that is all over social media which feeds the two sides and splits them further apart rather than bring them closer together.

Everyone should be able to make up their own mind as to whether they want to be vaccinated but it would be helpful if there was some absolute trustworthy source to help them decide which option to take. Only this week I read my news feed and saw some UK expert was saying that the Pandemic is behind us and then two days later a different UK Expert stated exactly the opposite. How does that assist the man in the street to make and informed decision?

I think the driving people apart is a sad reflection of the times tbh.
I think from day one the whole covid thing got politicised. It was a great stick to beat the governments over the head with.
No government made zero mistakes and some made more than others but if you are in opposition you can Monday morning quarterback the life out of it.

You only have to look at America. When Trump was in power the media would lovingly report every death in the US as they tried to blame him for them all.
Since Biden has been in there has barely been a word, so we can only assume Biden cured the virus overnight?

Tbh I treat any of the figures with some skepticism especially since I hear when the advance reports that the statistics for suicides in the U.K. and US for 2020 are going to see a drop.
I know someone who has quite a high up job on the railways in Scotland who says the number of people jumping in front of trains has quadrupled. I have no reason to think he is making that up but you may not trust my anecdotal evidence but logic tells me with people losing jobs, losing their homes, not seeing families or friends for months and the mental toll of lockdown the suicide rate falling does not ring true.

I think the concern here at the moment should be why are the numbers increasing at the rate they are? 188 new cases yesterday which is the highest daily rate so far. Whilst the figures given include things like how many are in hospital, how many are in ICU and how many have recovered. What they are not showing is how many that tested positive are actually double vaccinated? Also out of those how many are seriously ill or have died? That sort of information would be more useful and may actually assist people to make informed decisions.

Having said all of the above whose figures do we trust if any?

The problem with statistics is they can always be massaged or misinterpreted. Covid cases going up is reported covid cases going up so more people are being tested and the vaccine it’s self may cause a spike.
Also governments do need to justify their actions so some creative accountancy will help in that.

A lot of it comes down to how you interpret the data. To give an example years ago there was a statistic that 1 in 2 marriages were ending in divorce. On the face of it the figure was accurate if you compared the year’s marriages to the year’s divorces but there was a story within that told a different story.
Divorce had become much easier so couples who had lived together for 20 years in misery could now part ways so the number had a lot of historical marriages contained within it. Also marriage rates were going down so coupled with a backlog of people who finally could part company that skewed the figures considerably. So the statement was trueish but the underlying message was very inaccurate in that 50% of the year’s marriages were likely to end in divorce.

Sad to hear this about Scotland, a very traumatic thing for those involved to experience.Nobody really discusses mental health anymore or seasonal flu.

[Chriswright03]

Yes aside from the obvious problems with Covid as in getting it and if you survive we will never know just how much anguish and trauma has been caused to the vulnerable by all of the isolation. Some people cannot cope with life in normal times so little wonder many are in a situation where they feel the only way out is suicide.

On the other side of the coin I have a friend who is a train driver and twice in his career he has had somebody use his train to end it all. Nothing that he could do on either occasion and something he had to deal with mentally.

[forestpixie]

Yes aside from the obvious problems with Covid as in getting it and if you survive we will never know just how much anguish and trauma has been caused to the vulnerable by all of the isolation. Some people cannot cope with life in normal times so little wonder many are in a situation where they feel the only way out is suicide.

On the other side of the coin I have a friend who is a train driver and twice in his career he has had somebody use his train to end it all. Nothing that he could do on either occasion and something he had to deal with mentally.

Many people nowadays suffer with anxiety and being so isolated with all the information in the media has made it worse, my sister is one of these people. My mum in the UK also started to struggle with isolation mainly because she is so used to being out and about. I feel for your friend, I met a tube driver once who experienced the same thing he quit not long after the unfortunate event.

[waz-24-7]

Anti vaxers and abstainers are the weak link in the defence chain and now we are clearly seeing them in hospital.

So the vast majority of the people who are being hospitalised with covid are those who haven’t been vaccinated?

So Sir Patrick Vallance, the UK’s chief scientific adviser didn’t announce that around 40% of people being admitted to hospital with COVID in the UK have been vaccinated which given the vaccination programme would account for the spike wouldn’t it?

I believe the numbers in the UK clearly show that in our corner of the globe the war is being won. It appears that the under 24's and mainly unvaccinated are being attacked and are by enlarge the main group found in hospital where health care workers are once again taking up the baton to save the lives of those that wander the battle field naked and unarmed.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

I believe the numbers in the UK clearly show that in our corner of the globe the war is being won. It appears that the under 24's and mainly unvaccinated are being attacked and are by enlarge the main group found in hospital where health care workers are once again taking up the baton to save the lives of those that wander the battle field naked and unarmed.

So again, Sir Patrick Vallance, the UK’s chief scientific adviser didn’t announce that around 40% of people being admitted to hospital with COVID in the UK have been vaccinated which given the vaccination programme would account for the spike wouldn’t it?

[waz-24-7]

I believe the numbers in the UK clearly show that in our corner of the globe the war is being won. It appears that the under 24's and mainly unvaccinated are being attacked and are by enlarge the main group found in hospital where health care workers are once again taking up the baton to save the lives of those that wander the battle field naked and unarmed.

So again, Sir Patrick Vallance, the UK’s chief scientific adviser didn’t announce that around 40% of people being admitted to hospital with COVID in the UK have been vaccinated which given the vaccination programme would account for the spike wouldn’t it?

No,
firstly I think you'll find that Sir Patrick is very much for the vaccination programme. The vaccine is the weapon against the disease. It is not 100% effective but is very successful at reducing disease, viral load and hospitalisations.
As vaccine roll out continues globally and at pace the virus is further weakened and its ability to mutate is more restricted.
I think you may be referring to a statement in July. Regardless. The fact remains the vaccines work. The numbers are very clear indeed. Daily reports, data and analysis are uniformly supportive of the success of vaccination.

I'm not sure if you simply want to argue with me but anyone reading this. Step up get vaccinated. Individual choice is a secondary consideration as the vaccination is only really effective when the chain of defence is unbroken.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

I think you may be referring to a statement in July.

Possibly, I never realised it might be a whole two weeks ago!

Can you link to your up to date info that the vast majority of covid hospitalisations are unvaccinated people?

[waz-24-7]

To avoid confusion.
https://www.reuters.com/business/health ... 021-07-19/
60 % of hospitalisations is quite reflective. Vaccinated people can also succumbed but have a stronger chance survival. Various dats shows the outcomes in different age groups, ethnic groups and others

Could I suggest you do your own research on the effectiveness and resulting hospitalisations. I hope you support a vaccination programme.

It is the case that protection does not take effect for 14 days after vaccination. Currently it is seen that after both doses and post the 2 weeks period.
efficacy of circa 88% can be expected. This is less than previous variants as the virus is clearly fighting back via mutations and availability of host.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

To avoid confusion.
https://www.reuters.com/business/health ... 021-07-19/
60 % of hospitalisations is quite reflective. Vaccinated people can also succumbed but have a stronger chance survival. Various dats shows the outcomes in different age groups, ethnic groups and others

Could I suggest you do your own research on the effectiveness and resulting hospitalisations. I hope you support a vaccination programme.

So if 60% are unvaccinated then 40% are vaccinated?
Not a massive majority is it? You are usually picky on majorities such as 52-48 etc

[waz-24-7]

Oh dear again,
If you look closely at the data and analyse accordingly. There are several anomalies. Pregnant women form an inordinate portion of current hospitalised covid patients. Why?
Some media exposure installed a fear within this sector and many shy away from vaccination. I believe that is now changing.
Certainly some vaccinated patients have been caught out before they secured either full protection or only had the 1st jab or were infected very shortly after the jab.

I don't know what your point is in this. Without doubt; vaccination works in the war against Covid. Weakness of any type in the chain of defence is fuelling the ability for the virus to mutate and possibly override some of the vaccines.
Research and investigation into modifying current vaccines is ongoing at pace in order to stay ahead of this killer gremlin.
There is some way to go yet. Booster vaccines will certainly be rolled out as winter looms. Colder temperatures and more indoor living is just what covid and flu thrive upon.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

Certainly some vaccinated patients have been caught out before they secured either full protection or only had the 1st jab or were infected very shortly after the jab.

So when they have full protection they will be immune or not able to be hospitalised with covid? Is that what you are saying?

So a lot of people managed to not catch covid for 18 months but “we’re infected very shortly after the jab”?
What are the chances eh?

[waz-24-7]

Certainly some vaccinated patients have been caught out before they secured either full protection or only had the 1st jab or were infected very shortly after the jab.

So when they have full protection they will be immune or not able to be hospitalised with covid? Is that what you are saying?

So a lot of people managed to not catch covid for 18 months but “we’re infected very shortly after the jab”?
What are the chances eh?

The information you seek is readily available.
My understanding and belief is that vaccination reduces all aspects of succumbing to the disease. The immune system becomes massively more able to combat an attack. If the virus get a hold in ones body the vaccine limits viral load and also reduces any need for medical assistance.

It is now very well known that the virus is very highly transmissible and indeed is getting better at it as good soft and vulnerable host tissue becomes more scarce via vaccination.
I see no correlation between staying safe for 18 months and getting infected following the jab. It is because as lockdown reduced and ended the virus has been allowed to circulate within the community more. The 2 metre and other advice was there to inhibit the transmission. It essentially and eventually worked but it is vaccination that has changed the battle plan in our fight back.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

So you don’t really have a clue Waz? That’s fine your not a virologist after all

[waz-24-7]

So you don’t really have a clue Waz? That’s fine your not a virologist after all

And your educated view is ?

[EnjoyingTheSun]

Apparently suicides dropped 8.2% in England and Wales in 2020.
So with the stresses of lockdown, the isolation, the fears, the massive economic effects etc etc the suicide rate dropped?

Here is an interesting study which does sound credible;

https://www.health.org.uk/news-and-comm ... and-health

It says mental health has worsened substantially (by 8.1% on average) as a result of the pandemic.


If 8.1% is substantial then I assume 8.2% must be substantial too? So the suicide rate has substantially dropped during covid and the associated lockdown?

Unless of course worsening mental health has zero effect on the suicide rate?

Doesn’t seem credible to me.
What does seem likely is someone is getting creative with the figures.